Toby Mac and Third Day: More Examples of Covert Occultism?

I strongly recommend some preparatory reading if you really want to follow along and better understand this article: At a minimum, the Intro, Ch. 1, Ch.2, and Ch. 11 from my online "book", Wolves in Sheep's Clothing.


Below: Toby Mac-- a "rapper" formerly with DC Talk (now on his own), well-known in the Contemporary Christian Music world.



Notice the obvious Lion's Paw occult symbol pose with his right hand. Notice the (Masonic) black and white checkered shirt. Notice how one of his eyes is obscured in the shadows, thus creating the All-Seeing Eye presentation.

Masonic halls throughout the world manifest this black-and-white tiling. The British royal family, among the world's leading occultists, celebrated the recent wedding of Prince William at Westminster Abbey, a structure literally overloaded with satanic symbolism...including the black and white tiling (see below):



Not to mention...the satanic priest who presided over the wedding ceremony. Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Cantebury, is also a confirmed and practicing Druid. Orthodox Bible students would routinely equate Druidism to Satanism. Notice how his hands are conspicuously pointed downwards...a blatant indication of luciferian allegiance. This is known in the occult world as "praying to the Devil".



And notice below, the yoni-shaped hats worn by various guests at the wedding (except for the third photo). The hat designers have bent over backwards to incorporate occult symbols in these hat designs. The football-shaped yoni symbol is the female counterpart to phallic symbolism seen throughout elite satanic circles:


(Special thanks to the GalatiansFour blog for these insights into the royal wedding!)


Getting back to Toby Mac--look at some of his CD covers. The "one eye" presentations go on and on. I have used a couple of red highlighting circles:









In the context of these other occult indicators, I would dare surmise this one (below) looks very much like a pyramid (elongated though it may be)...and another "all-seeing eye" at the top of the pyramid. Conceptually similar, for example, to the pyramid/all-seeing-eye presentation on the US One Dollar bill.




Here is another photo, apparently taken during the same session as the one at the top. Notice he seems to be, again, carefully keeping his hand in this same position-- the Lion's Paw position. And once again, his one eye is obscured in the shadows...creating yet another 'one eye' presentation. Creepy stuff!




In this photo (apparently a wider angle of the photo at the top), notice the overall posture..as though he is saluting, almost in a soldier-like fashion. A 'soldier' in which army though?




Notice the grouping of "buildings" at the bottom of this cover. This is a pretty obvious "flipping the bird" phallic presentation. An indication of the kind of hatred a "wolf in sheep's clothing" secretly carries against his Christian fans? This kind of 'naughty' optical illusion has been done many times before. Not very original stuff. See the movie poster example further below.




Hollywood movie poster--"Visioneers":




Here is a DC Talk album cover with a very obvious "all-seeing eye" satanic symbol.


Notice also those emanating rays. You will see those all over the occult world. This may have originated with Aleister Crowley who depicted these rays in his symbolism designs. This depiction (below) appeared in Crowley's satanic book "The Book of Law" (1904). The "rays" supposedly represent the 'enlightenment' which emanates from Lucifer:



Below: Another example of occult "rays"--Meria Heller, a popular Internet psychic. Orthodox Bible students would, of course, prefer the term "witchcraft practitioner".



Another example: Crowley's satanic rays, right smack on the logo of a US government agency--the ultra-creepy Information Awareness Office--




More indication from Michael W. Smith? Can you spot the apparent evidence below? It took me a while but...there it is, right in the center of the photo: The Kabbalah bracelets on his wrist:





This is a poster advertising a recent mini-tour involving Michael Smith, Toby Mac, Third Day, and Max Lucado. Here again, we see these emanating rays.



I have begun to run across some indications of occultism in connection with Max Lucado. Some of his book cover designs deftly incorporate triangles and truncated pyramids (see below).




But it could very well be that he has no awareness of his book cover designs nor of the potential indications of occult allegiance with the people in the concert poster photo. He certainly has fallen hook-line-and-sinker for this new-fangled Contemplative Prayer nonsense (thinly veiled Eastern-style occultism), which is coming from the Emergent Church crowd. That does not

I have been baffled and saddened at the way in which so many Evangelical luminaries have somehow been sucked into this stuff--Chuck Swindoll, Bill Hybels, Phillip Yancey...on and on.


More occult indicators from Toby Mac: The photo below seems to depict some disturbingly ingenious stuff. Let me say this carefully: In the context of all these other occult symbols...this looks like a modifed "square and compass" Masonic symbol presentation.

Satanists and Masons (many times, these two are one and the same category) have created a huge variety of modified "square and compass" presentations. I provide examples all throughout my "Wolves" blog/book. We've already seen how Toby Mac has previously flashed Masonic indicators. This appears to be yet another.



If you look carefully at his very odd and conspicuous pose, his right arm appears to represent the "square"...and his left arm is positioned as a "compass". The classic Masonic square has a 90 degree angle, and the compass has a V shape, exactly as Toby Mac seems to be presenting it:




Below: A suspected "Square and Compass" presentation from Kenneth Copeland. You can read in the latter part of my Ch.13 regarding potential evidence of Copeland's occult allegiances.



Below: Again, IN CONTEXT...this appears to be an occult symbol presentation...by use of deliberately structured triangular facial hair. Recall Michael Smith's 'hair issues' in Ch.1 of "Wolves"!



And if all of that isn't enough, Toby Mac actually has a song about (in support of?) the Illuminati, entitled "Ill-M-I". What in the world?!--

Ill-M-I, Ill-M-I, Ill-M-I, Ill-M-I and you
Illuminati comin' thru
Ill-M-I, Ill-M-I, Ill-M-I, Ill-M-I and you
Illuminati comin' thru


LINK--Youtube video: Toby Mac's 13 Ill-M-I


THIRD DAY

As far as Third Day...they do have a very blatant occult symbol for their official logo (see below--red highlighted rectangle)...but until recently I had hoped they were merely like a number of other Christian bands who may only be inadvertently using occult symbolism because they think it "looks cool". Upon closer inspection though, I am no longer so optimistic about these guys.



Their logo (see above) combines a Sufi-style winged presentation with a moon god symbol (the intersecting crescents) at the center.

Here is a Third Day CD cover with just the moon symbolism, minus the Sufi wings:



These intersecting crescents can apparently also double as a "yoni" presentation. Occultists love double, triple, quadruple (etc.) meanings for their symbols. Recall the yoni-shaped hats worn by royal 'elites', earlier in this article.

And the aforementioned Sufi occultism comes out of the Muslim world. In the same way Kabbalism is a satanic counterpart to Judaism, Sufi occultism is the explicitly satanic alternative to Islam. Below: Typical Sufi wing symbolism--

LINK


On this Third Day cover art there is a depiction of the "infinity" occult symbol.

Yes, it has a legitmate role as a mathematics symbol. But this is also (and primarily) a well-established satanic indicator. Below, you see an example of the ancient occultic Alchemy symbol for brimstone. It incorporates both the Double Cross of Lorraine, as well as the Infinity symbol. Both are occult symbols in their own right.



Below--yet another occultic depiction of the infinity symbol--on a Tarot card referred to as "The Magician". And below that, the 2007 Christmas CD from Michael W. Smith which, as you see, incorporates the infinity symbol twice.






More "Third Day" occult symbolism:



There are any number of occult symbols on this CD cover. For now, I'll point out two of them. Firstly, you see in the lower red-highlighted circle...the symbol for "chaos"...with the eight outward-pointed arrows. This occult indicator is so obvious that Third Day fans were raising questions about it on the band's discussion board:

"Hi, I'm very concerned about the following. On their latest album, Third Day uses a occult symbol which stands for chaos (the circle with eight arrows coming from it). If you google for images on "symbol chaos", you will see the image they used. For those of you who read Dutch look the symbol up on www.verhoevenmarc.be/_symbolen.doc.

I do not understand why a 'Christian' band would use such a symbol. Especially since our God is a God of order and not of chaos. Third Day if one you guys reads this, please explain why you use the symbol."
LINK

LINK

The other (oval-shaped) red-highlighting: I strongly suspect (given the context) this is the Masonic "A". Understanding this particular aspect may require 10-15 minutes of reading (if you haven't done so already) through my "Tim LaHaye" section of Ch.14. Go to that chapter and scroll down just a bit, until you see the "Tim LaHaye" heading. A little bit of the way through the LaHaye section, I get into this specific matter of the Masonic "A".




I can be emailed at matttwofour@yahoo.com.
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218 comments:

  1. Hi everyone,

    I don't listen to CCM but have heard of some of these people/groups. It's not surprising though in light of what we know. The shocker is what you wrote about on your online book Matt. Michael W. Smith I would never have imagined and the rock bands... what words can I use? Disturbing, shocking, disgusting, sickening and horrible to say the least.

    I also read the lyrics to Toby Mac's song. Bible Believer, I noticed what you did too. I had to mute it too. Yuk, it would be torture to listen to it! :( The words are weird and extremely suspect. They probably mean just what we think they do.

    Along with the groups from Rocket Town (and Skillet), I discovered something last year. Since the digital transition, I now have TBN, The Church Channel and JCTV. Sadly there's not much good only any of them but CC has a few shows worth watching. Anyway, one night when I couldn't sleep, I turned on JCTV which mostly has "Christian" music groups or youth oriented (teens) programs. Lo and behold on the weekend, after midnight, I was shocked to see some of those same groups and others just like them that played at concerts at Rocket Town!! Unbelievable! I guess they figure the parents will be asleep and teenagers that stay up late can watch. I couldn't understand what some of them were singing since they were what I call "scream bands". You know, with that demonic sounding voice. The bands I could understand were not singing about Jesus. It wasn't a one time thing either. I purposely checked more than a few times after that. Very Gothic looking and bizarre. All of it.

    After reading all about Laurel Canyon from your book, it's obvious they are "chosen", just like most politicians and actors/actresses. Everybody that's anybody is connected to TPTB.

    P.S. I don't know how to do the Google Account thing or know what the OpenID is either. I DO know what Anonymous means though, so I'm not totally technologically challenged. :) I don't do any soCIAl networking.

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  2. Just a bit of news on Toby Mac. Seems he is putting out a new Christmas album. Now that I am looking closer at him and his lyrics and symbols and such, I noticed his Christmas album shows three pyramids stacked (tree) within a circle. Interesting, no?

    http://www.jesusfreakhideout.com/news/2011/07/06.TobyMac%20To%20Release%20Christmas%20In%20Diverse%20City%20October%204.asp

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  3. ChaffSorter--

    Thanks for the supportive comments. To reassure you--I have no faith in Zeitgeist. Haven't even watched the thing. I've read enough descriptions. And I agree--the people behind Zeitgeist are globalists advancing behind a false front.

    As far as banking--for me it's very simple: I believe the Fed's counterfeiting is evil and immoral...designed to ruin our economy. But yes...also there has been a problem (deliberately perpetrated, I believe) of saddling folks with loans they can't afford.

    By the way, I want NO role for the "state". In a world according to me...everyone should be able to have their own private domain. I get most of my info about economics from the libertarian sites LewRockwell.com and Mises.org.

    In the future...if you want, you can tag a comment on any of my blog articles here. I do have one on Chase Bank, for example. But right here is fine also.

    I'll check out your blog. Thanks.

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  4. I was fairly chagrined to find out Christmas trees (according to my info) were introduced to Europeans by kabbalic satanists...specifically, I believe, the daughter of notorious kabbalist, Jacob Frank.

    Apparently, it was a kabbalic custom up to the mid or late 1800's. Then...it seems kabbalists very slyly ceased use of Christmas trees so as to allow it to become a "Christian" custom.

    I think I'm getting more interested in a close scrutiny of the exact sequence of events whereby these trees became "Christian". I think Frank's daughter may be the key.

    Doesn't help anything that there is a point-blank OT scripture (that I wasn't aware of until a couple of years ago) which forbids bringing Evergreen trees into the house for decoration. I don't just now recall the exact chapter/verse.

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    1. Martin Luther had a Christmas Tree. That was about 1500s.

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    2. OK well...I'm not sure about the various dates of origins. Maybe my 1800's dating is off but...are you arguing that Christmas has an innocent origin with no satanic connection?

      I'll come back here in a couple of days with a more careful report about the matter. And there STILL is the explicit OT Bible verse forbidding Christmas trees and Christmas tree decoration.

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  5. I'm almost afraid to use a "V" in case you might think a Mason or that I'm part of the occult.....

    I get that you don't like contemporary Christian music, it can be pretty bad, but I think you might be looking too much into things that have no meaning whatsoever. Are these musicians REALLY trying to portray an occultish image? Is that REALLY their intent? Perhaps they are better off having a blank cover with no images inside so people can't misconstrue and judge the state of their hearts (and hopefully no words with "v's").

    I think if you looked at some of the art in the music you yourself listen to you might find some of the same things. Will you throw stones at them as well?
    Look, you seem like an intelligent person, but I'm pretty sure you are doing exactly what Jesus has asked us not to do, and that is to judge the heart of others. If you look at things with such a critical eye, you miss the blessing and the Spirit's work in the world.

    I'm more concerned that you constantly jump to occultish conclusions and condemn people. In my mind, THAT is "luciferianism". Honestly, picking at the hats women wore at the Royal Wedding is so fickle and ridiculous! What in your life makes you so unhappy that you will throw stones at every sinner you come across? Do you even read the Bible, or do you just read the parts that support your poor theology?

    I will pray for you and those who seem to follow your words. I will pray that your heart will be warmed by the love of Jesus, not wrath. I will pray that your eyes will be opened to the Holy Spirit's movement within this crazy world. I will pray that you will throw compassion and understanding instead of stones.
    Please, for the sake of those who love and follow Jesus all over the world, stop spewing hate and ignorance and start speaking as Jesus spoke.

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  6. Mr. Groenink--
    You "get" that I don't like CCM? You "get" wrong. I like CCM.

    You say my own music "might" have evidence of occultism? No, the music I listened to all my life DID and DOES show signs of occult allegiance.

    Jesus did NOT forbid us from discerning evil wolves who may have infiltrated the church. It's the exact opposite, my friend. Good grief.

    Secondly, my focus is not on whether Toby Mac (as one example) is actually a wolf. Rather...my focus is to point out the indications of occult symbolism.

    There IS such a thing as occult symbolism...and there ARE people who use occult symbolism. Not sure how you're managing to extract controversy from this scenario. You're saying we shouldn't point out the "chaos" occult symbol of Third day's CD cover? And all the occult symbolism on Michael W Smith's CD covers?

    Do you think Planet Earth is a huge Disneyland where all the people you THINK are 'angels of light' ARE 'angels of light'...or do you believe the Bible's assessment--that we live in a satanic world system, dominated by the Devil (1John 5:19) and his minions? I lean away from Walt Disney and more towards the Bible's advisories.

    You haven't been fooled ONCE even? Every single Christian VIP you know of...is the real deal? Not a single wolf among them?

    ------------------------------
    Groenink quote #1:
    "Jesus has asked us not...to judge the heart of others."

    Groenink quote #2:
    "In my mind, [your behavior] is luciferianism."
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    First you say Jesus has said we are not to judge others...you then proceed to judge others. A massive contradiction.

    You make 3 or 4 other comments following that in which you are making "judgments" as to my inner thoughts and "heart". If you believe in a false doctrine which forbids us from attempting to discern...then you should PRACTICE that false doctrine.

    You say I must be unhappy because of all my "stone throwing". Are we to assume you also are "unhappy" by virtue of the stones you're throwing at me? Fair question.

    If you're actually sincere and not just some young 'fella' who likes to spitball blogs...you should read my thesis from the beginning...Intro and Ch.1 of "Wolves In Sheep's Clothing".

    Your references to the "hats" and some other things seem to indicate you've done very little reading on the subject and have merely browsed through this one blog article about Toby Mac.

    When Toby Mac, Third Day, and these many others are putting "chaos" satanic symbols and Masonic signalings on their CD covers...I point it out. Doesn't necessarily mean they're satanic (as you dishonestly assert of me, despite my several careful disclaimers)...but the occult symbolism IS there and Jesus has forwarned us of a huge infiltration of satanic "Christian" leaders in the end times.

    If you don't like some of my evidence...YOU tell ME...where ARE those 'end times' wolves Jesus has warned of?? Have you spotted any of them? Jesus explicitly instructs to look out for them (Matthew 24). Have you followed His directive?

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    Replies
    1. Matt,

      You come across as very angry, lashing out at people that are saying things about you that they perceive when they don't even know you. But don't you see that you are doing the vary same thing? I will agree that there is a lot of judging going on here, but look at the scripture. Judging Others

      Matthew 7:1-5 1 “Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. 3 Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

      Instead of writing books pointing out other peoples problems, we should be working on getting our own messes cleaned up. I do understand the point you are making in not saying that these men are satanic, only that you see things on their album covers, but please just think about the impact of your words and how they affect the people that you are talking about. Pray for these people.

      Matthew 5:43-48

      Love Your Enemies

      43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. 46 For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47 And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? 48 You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

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    2. I've re-read the Toby Mac article. I don't see any flashes of anger. Where have you seen this...if you could point it out?

      In any case...if you're accusing me of being wrongfully "angry" and that I "lash out" at people...haven't you just wrongfully issued judgment on me...according to your own standards?

      I think certain people are doing something wrong...so I point it out.

      You think certain people (me, specifically) are doing something wrong so you point it out.

      For you it's OK to be "judgmental"...but for me it's not OK? You've created an instant double standard, me-thinks!

      Add to that...I'm not sure what exactly you're confused about on the broad biblical subject of 'wolves infiltrating the flock'. It's a huge and critical subject matter in the Bible.

      Inadvertently (or not so inadvertently?) you're arguing that we should leave these 'poor' wolves alone when they're invading the flock...because we might hurt their feelings by pointing out the satanic symbolism their displaying. Come on now.

      I never say outright "he's a satanic wolf". But, for example, in Toby Mac's case, I'll point out the satanic symbolism and tell people to watch their step.

      It may be in some cases, these Christian pop singers, preachers, authors, etc...are unaware of the symbolism...but if they don't respond when the symbolism on their publications is pointed out...the suspicion levels tend to skyrocket.

      To say (as you are) that we're not loving our enemies by pointing out these infiltrating wolves...is ridiculous. We can love our enemies but we'll still resist and oppose their attempts at infiltration.

      I take it you're not too familiar with the Olivet Discourse? There Jesus warns of these large numbers of "false prophet" wolves who emerge in the last days to perpetrate a deadly apostasy plot which will (by the way) be hugely and tragically successful...and He tells us to look out for these wolves and to warn others.

      Inadvertently, you're attempting to step in front of me as I seek to follow Jesus' instructions. That's unfortunate.

      There ARE wolves in the flock. If you don't like the ones I've pointed out as potential suspects...then YOU give it a shot! Where ARE these wolves Jesus warned of in the Olivet Discourse?

      If you see somebody who has numerous satanic indicators in their publications and in their life....what exactly is it you propose that we do that wouldn't be "judgmental"? I'd really like to know.

      You're describing these satanic wolves merely as "people who have problems". Are you serious? All due respect but...I can barely believe that level of carelessness and glibness.

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    3. When I said that I could see anger, it was not in the original post, but in your replies to those who comment. As far as judgment goes, yes I was wrongfully judging you, I am admitting that and I apologize. I'm not arguing that you "leave them alone", rather that you actually bring it to their attention, no offense, but I doubt that they read this blog to be able to defend themselves. I'm not saying there are not wolves, I'm saying, from what I know, these people are not. I don't know who is either, I focus on teaching the younger generation sound biblical teachings, rather than hunting down the wolves, I help to protect the sheep from them when they come. Finally, no, I do not believe that wolves are just people with problems, sorry if I came across that way, I fully believe that you are right about the wolves aspect of the Olivet discoure, I just don't see these people as wolves.

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    4. I looked over the entire comment thread beneath this Toby Mac article. I found no 'anger' and no 'lashing'. (?)

      What's wrong with a little anger anyway? The Devil is tricking the majority of Bible believers into Hell by means of the apostsasy plot described by Jesus in the Olivet discourse. A little passion and vehemence does the soul good, it seems to me.

      For me it's like standing on the side of the highway, trying to wave down a bus full of people which is headed for a washed out bridge and a raging flooded river. As I'm yelling and frantically waving my arms, people inside the bus are commenting:

      "I don't think I like that man's tone. I don't appreciate his frantic, impolite waving."

      From where I'm standing, it madness. It's like being in a bad dream where you can't run fast enough. The conservative Bible-believing world has been completely infiltrated by satanic wolves, exactly and precisely as Jesus prophesied.

      If you're having trouble believing an entire army of satanists are going to populate (and/or ARE doing so presently) the top leadership positions among conservative Christians...then, your credibility problem is with the Lord Jesus Himself, all due respect.

      Read the Olivet Discourse repeatedly...until His words of warning begin to sink in...the best advice I can give!

      And you're not wrong to come along side a brother and try to point out wrongful behavior. I disagree with your definitions of "judgmental", top to bottom.

      I'm not going to melt if somebody critiques my beliefs. That's why there are such huge disasters currently going on in the church world--these skewed ideas about "judging" are keeping people from sounding a warning cry.

      As one of hundreds of examples, Michael W. Smith has a youth club in downtown Nashville where he and his people are scheduling appearances for a steady succession of hardcore "Satan metal" bands...whose lyrics have explicit, satanic messages.

      Are any pastors in the area saying anything? No, they're either asleep, don't care, or are too "polite" and "non-judgmental". Meanwhile, hundreds of Christian parents are unknowingly sending their kids to this place.

      Also, I constantly get this scolding-- "have you contacted them?". For the record, these people have been repeatedly contacted by numerous folks, long before I ever got here. Did you read my blog article, just above? Fans are writing to Third Day, asking them why they display satanic symbols on their CD covers. No answer.

      These guys are providing zero answers. The Michael Smith debacle has even seeped into the Internet mainstream. Not a peep from "Smitty".

      Hundreds of people have emailed David Jeremiah about the satanic 'all-seeing-eye' stained glass window his church has installed up on the wall behind the pulpit. They've all been blown off. Do I think Jeremiah is a wolf? I tend to think not. More likely, he has been duped and probably has wolves working in his proximity, in his organization. He's certainly big on PreTrib...which for me is one of the deadliest deceptions out there.

      Secondly, are you thinking this through? If a particular individual is a satanic wolf...and we email them, asking if they're a satanic wolf...how well do you think that email exchange is going to go? How much progress do you think we would make in getting them to reveal their satanic allegiance? Come on now.

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    5. Another thing:

      You say you want to focus on "sound biblical teachings". OK...have you taught them Jesus' warnings about the apostasy plot in the Olivet Discourse? Jesus instructs (among many things there) to be on the look-out for this plot and on the look-out for these "false prophets", i.e. satanic "Christian" leaders. These are Christian leaders with such spectacular counterfeiting skills that the vast majority of the church world will be fooled.

      In my view, if you aren't passing along Jesus' explicit warnings in the Olivet Discourse...they're walking straight into the teeth of satanic deception. It is virtually impossible to "protect the sheep" if they're walking into this trap.

      Finally...you say "I just don't see these people as wolves". Which "people"?? And on what do you base your dismissal of the research? I've been studying and investigating this Olivet Discourse "false prophet" phenomenon for nigh unto a decade. You've quickly browsed through one, single blog article...and come up with a final judgment?

      I've written a 500-page online book (Wolves In Sheep's Clothing), linked at the top of this page...starting with a look at the aforementioned Michael Smith, his multitude of satanic symbol displays...and his blatantly satanic "youth club" in Nashville.

      I would encourage you or anyone...give the Olivet Discourse thesis a bit more time...read slowly, carefully and thoughtfully through the Discourse and through some of the evidence presentation in my book.

      All respect but...you kind of dodged my question in the comments from a couple of days ago: If you don't like some of the wolf suspects I'm pointing out...then where ARE these prophesied wolves? Have you spotted any? I'm not talking about the garishly ridiculous, over-the-top TV evangelists with the million-dollar homes and private jets...easily recognizable charlatans. No, Jesus has revealed in Matthew 24 (the Olivet Discourse) that these wolves will be spectacularly deceptive...spectacularly camouflaged.

      I challenge you to point out even one single Christian leader on the scene day...but who is actually satanic behind the scenes. Have you spotted a single one of these?

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    6. Amen Matt! I think it's tragic that modern Christianity has lost the fervor it once had. When I think of the language once used at the revivals during the early 20th century that won thousands upon thousands of souls for Christ, let alone the language Jesus himself used when addressing the "respected" religious leaders of the time and all their heresy, it makes me sad how weak and spineless Christians have become all in order to not be offensive, and make sure we're not going to hurt anyone's feelings. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with anything you have said on this page, and I would venture to say that anyone calling themselves a Christian should be ashamed for trying to stifle your voice when you are simply shedding light on the wickedness (whether intentional or not) of people who supposedly represent the Almighty God! What you are saying is being judgmental???? Wow... how far down the slippery slope of "politically correct" have we gone when we can no longer point out un-Christian behavior for fear that we might offend someone?! I don't think people know the difference between judgment and rebuking evil these days. Basically being critical of anyone for any reason these days automatically makes you "judgmental" and people start misusing scripture to shame you. If we can plainly see that a Christian brother or sister is aligning themselves with evil (whether intentionally or not) is it not proper to point out and rebuke their actions instead of letting them continue to mix light with darkness? Let me remind my brothers and sisters, 1 Timothy 5:20 - As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them IN THE PRESENCE OF ALL, so that the rest may stand in fear. Maybe I'm taking this out of context, but if a CHRISTIAN artist is plastering symbolism all over their album covers that cannot be distinguished from that of occult and out-right satanic symbolism, should we not speak out against it publicly? If the verse 2 Corinthians 6:14 - "Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?" is to be taken seriously, then wouldn't that mean that a Christian musician should NOT have occult imagery all over their products, and they should expect their Christian brothers and sisters to rebuke such sin publicly? One cannot claim ignorance if said occult imagery has been pointed out to them.

      Again, this has already been quoted, but here it is again, maybe people will get it this time...

      Matthew 7:15-23
      15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. 18A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus you will recognize them by their fruits.
      21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

      Delete
    7. Calm down, I think all these hypocrites, the ones that accuse your discernment as judgement, and quote made-up biblical un-scripture... I think it's one of the youthful offspring of the elite, or their deadpan, bottom-level masons, to argue with you or threaten you to get you to shut up.

      They fear those of us who are awake. Because just as they can use "Christian" music, literature, movies, etc to fool people into thinking they're letting Christ in when they're actually going anti-Christ (instead of Christ)... they know that we, too, can wake up the sheeple. If the sheeple wake up, they will do like all the other countries, revolt and go on an old-fashioned witch hunt from which these fools cannot hide. So, their 'jobs' are to bully or threaten people into backing down and shutting up.

      If you take a good listen to TobyMac in reverse, you will hear what you've been pointing out, allegiance to Lucifer. CCM is much worse than the mainstream stuff, because it's disguised as Christian, which is why I put in in quotation marks at the beginning, because it is far from Christian. Not that there aren't any CCM songs and bands out there that aren't truly praising God and Christ, because there are. They're just very few and far between.

      Bottom line: If it's popular enough that the band/singer is invited to appear on a live tv show to lipsynch, or even sing, it's what you've been saying, a wolf in sheep's clothing.

      Keep up with scripture and you can rightfully discern all this, as you have been doing.

      Delete
    8. Yes, I wouldn't be surprised if there have been some (shall we say) semi-professional Illuminati apologists who have stopped by.

      Delete
  7. OK, Anonymous...about the "Sunday law" book...I wanted to get familiarized with the book before commenting. Honestly, I have very significant problems with 7th Day doctrines. They have had a prophetess, Ellen G. White, who claimed special revelation from God. That's a huge no-no for me. I believe in absolutely NO extra-biblical revelation. God has spoken through His Word and nowhere else. Therefore, for me, 7th Day is fundamentally flawed.

    In browsing through the book (on Scribd.com) I see all kinds of problems: Numerology, for one. Not good. I put it on the same level as "reading tea leaves", to be frank

    The whole idea that the Sunday law is to be equated with the mark of the beast: There's no logical sequence of evidence or argumentation, that I can see. The entirety of the "mark" has to do with totalitarian economic control. A "Sunday law" would not achieve such control in any way, shape or form. It would merely have a relatively tiny bunch of 7th Day'ers up in arms.

    The "mark" is something that is placed "in the hand and in the forehead". The author has completely lost me with this "Sunday law" business.

    By the way, did you get a chance to read the whole section I have on the "mark" in Chapter Fourteen?

    Finally...I do not believe we are under Old Testament law. If someone insists on Saturday church...how about stonings? How about animal sacrifice? If they're going to follow one law...they need to follow them all. Paul stated clearly in Galatians 5:6-- "For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value."

    If "circumcision" is gone...so is all the rest of OT law.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Anonymous--

    No need to run off! I don't get your reference to Paul as a "wolf". But I've heard that before.

    The reference to "sabbath day" in Matt.24:20 is not proof of its validity. It is merely Jesus recognizing that escaping out of Jerusalem and Palestine will be a nightmare if it occurs on a Saturday. And He's exactly right--to this day, everything slows to a creeping crawl in Jerusalem on Saturdays. El Al doesn't fly. All others means of transportation are severely curtailed.

    As I said (and there are many other evidences from Scripture about this)...if "circumcision" has been removed, then ALL the OT laws are now defunct. How could it be otherwise? How could only one "law" become defunct...and not all the others?

    Like I said, I haven't found any OT law proponents who actually fully practice OT law...who sacrifice animals or practice stoning (along with a hundred other omissions).

    ReplyDelete
  9. Matt,
    I recently came across a site that showed how Max Lucado has subtle open ended triangles on most of his book covers. I looked at a book of his that I had and sure enough there it was. I wasn't surprised because of how prolific he is in the literary world. I guess when a person sells out to TPTB they make you huge. For a price of course. Matthew 16:26.

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  10. I think originally we were discussing CCM and secular music here. Just wanted to add that I think Bono is one of the biggest wolves out there. It is interesting how Bono, Oprah, and Rick Warren are all huge philantrhopists and call themselves Christians but are anything but. I recently saw a picture of Steven Curtis Chapman with his mouth covered similar to the "shhh" jesture. My mouth dropped. In his wife's book the whole family was doing the Baphomet sign but at the time I thought they were just being cute. Now not so sure. I haven't been okayed to post on Vigilant Citizen. I think they are a bit enamored and/or obsessed by TPTB sometimes. I never had another group refuse for me to post.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Jane--

    Whoops-- I'm not getting proper email notification when someone posts comments here. Missed your comments from a couple of days ago.

    Max Lucado? Ouch. I don't want to think all these guys are wolves. I'll have to check out those triangles.

    Yes, I have heard much about U2 having been bought and sold into the Antichrist movement. I am curious as to the corruption process. I know they started off flying the Christian flag. Maybe they were wolves from the start? You have guys like CCM artist Steve Taylor hugely approving and almost adoring of Bono.

    I really, really want to believe Steven Chapman is a good guy. Interestingly, he and his wife made passing comments on the Larry King about 'questionable' aspects to their daughter's death...as if there are aspects to it that puzzled them. Interesting.

    This is almost unspeakable but...I know these SRA psychos can take people's children (such as Chapman's son) and in very quick succession put them under mind-control, compelling them to commit horrible deeds. I hope and pray such is not the case.

    I just thought is was dubious..first the tragedy of his daughter and then secondly, MW Smith comes quickly swooping in to offer a joint concert tour with Chapman, and which was laden down with the whole "globalism"/"support the troops" propaganda.

    Are you talking about Chapman's "Speechless" CD cover? I have only a vague awareness of the "shhh" symbolism. What is it properly called?

    Who really knows what the story is on all these things. I guess we'll only truly find out who is who when the Apostasy Plot is in the offing.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Sometimes I wonder if this is the type of stuff that what is talking about when he says " Even the elect shall be decieved" Many people do not know but the upside down star is a symbol of satan the 2 horns up are the horns and the other 3 down points are considered the beard. A few weeks ago I saw my local christian radio station using their logo on an upsidedown star magnet and the Christian channel Daystar has the upsidedown star too. It really makes you wonder who that comes in the name of Christ can you really trust.

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  13. Dana--

    This Matt TwoFour--my comments section is goofed up--it's forcing me to post "anonymously".

    Actually the Bible says the elect "would be deceived if it were possible". In other words, the deceptions will be spectacular and only the "elect" will manage to withstand the hypnotic deceptions.

    Most Bible believers will apparently turn out not to have been the "real deal". Jesus states directly that "the love of most will grow cold" and only those who hold to the faith "until the end" will be saved. Apparently FAR fewer of the folks you see around you in Bible-believing churches will turn out to have been genuine Christians. Very tragic. I know a lot of nice people who go to Bible churches.

    Yes, I've noticed the Daystar logo. There are a couple of other "Christian" networks that are equally dubious. Just look at Daystar's programming line-up: Nothing but dupes and wolves.

    If they're not exposing the evils of Antichrist militarism (currently headed by the US), and not shouting rooftop warnings about the Emergent Church and their Contemplative Prayer occultism...and aren't passing along Jesus' warning (in the Olivet Discourse) regarding a huge, upcoming 'apostasy deception plot' perpetrated by satanic "Christian" leaders...

    ...then Daystar is part of the problem, not part of the solution.

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  14. Dear author of this article,

    I very strongly ask you to re-consider the declarations that you are making in this article. It seems to me that this 'evidence' that you have present against TobyMac is not very strong. If you take a look at the photos again, the things you are describing as being part of an occult, such as the "one-eye" phenomenon, are merely poses taken by a photographer that are artisitcally pleasing to the eye. Instead of looking at the different angles of the camera, why not look at the fruit of toby's work? for as someone with a relationship with God, they will be bearing good fruit. If they were producing bad fruit, God will for sure "cut them off" as it says in John 15. As far as I can see, TobyMac's career continues to succeed, from 1988 til the current day. If he were part of an occult, I'm sure that God would not allow him to be "in power" of the Christian music world for so long. PLus, we should not be looking and judging people from the outside, for we do not know what the person is like from the inside, for the "Lord looks at the heart". I ask you to re-consider posting your article, as what is the purpose of this article? Is it to prove someone is part of an occult, or is the underlying purpose of this article to judge the fruit of Contemporary Christian artists, which in essence is saying God doesn't do a good enough job, and placing yourself instead as God.
    Finally, I encourage you to but read the Bible and instead of looking other places for your wisdom on 'judging' others, to look to God and see what He says in His word about all things, like loving your enemies and so on, and see if TobyMac's life matches with the Bible's teaching. Actions speak louder than words. Also, look up James 1:5. Instead of looking to human wisdom that we possess, look to God and ask him for his wisdom. For without his wisdom, we know nothing and look at the world through a pair of impaired glasses.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Anonymous of Oct.29, 2011 1:45 PM--

    This Matt TwoFour responding to your comments.

    These poses are merely "artistic" gimmicks? What do you base that claim on? It's merely a bare assertion as far as I can tell. You are strangely overlooking a very large context in this article...and very carefully presented evidence. Toby Mac's published materials manifest seven "eye" presentations just in the limited assortment of evidence in my one article here. That's a bit pollyannish to leap to an arbitrary conclusion that it's merely a coincidence.

    You refer to the "fruit" of Mac's work. Were you talking about his "Illuminati comin' through" song? I missed the fruit on that one.

    Yes, I always tell folks to allow for the possibility that Mac and some of these other Christian pop artists are being manipulated. But...after running into several dozens of these scenarios...are we to believe there is an international conspiracy of satanic graphic artists and music managers? Theorize whatever floats your boat. Bottom line--there is a huge satanic infiltration going on in the Evangelical world.

    Jesus said many satanic and hugely deceptive "Christian" leaders would emerge in the end times. Have you personally spotted any of them yet? Even a single one? When trying to spot these guys, I tend to lean towards the ones who display numerous occult symbols. Call me Sherlock. :)

    Toby Mac's career "succeeding" is a sign of God's blessing??? Come on now. KISS is still filling up arenas too. Can I get an "amen"?

    What is the purpose of my article, you ask? To pass along Jesus' warning...that many satanic "Christian" leaders will emerge in these last days. Spectacularly deceptive counterfeits who will successfully lure the majority of Bible believers straight through the gates of Hell. Read the Olivet Discourse. It's all there.

    I feel that (rather, I hope and pray for such) even a smidgen of warning from someone like myself, tucked away in the back of my readers' minds...might pop up in their thinking, when they see and hear these "false prophets" trying to lure then into their traps at some point in the not-too-distant future. That's my goal: Giving a 'heads-up' to fellow believers...to answer your question.

    If you're a serious-minded individual, you really ought to read my online "book" from the beginning. Take a careful look at these emerging "false prophets" which Jesus clearly and plainly forewarned of. "Wolves In Sheep's Clothing" is linked at the top of this page.

    As I said--if you have failed to spot even a single counterfeit, satanic agent posing as a top-level "Christian" VIP...then you need to (as I needed to, not so long ago) seriously question as to what has gone awry with your discernment and perception.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Anonymous, sure. I can see all the representations if i squint my eyes, bend my head sideways, and put on 3-D glasses. Then sure, sorta kinda almost looks like a symbol.... If Tobymac is part of the illumanati or whatever, he needs to give us more obvious symbols. Not really any here.

      Delete
    2. You need to "squint your eyes, bend your head sideways and use 3D glasses" to see Mac's plain-as-the-nose-on-your-face Lion's Paw pose in the photo at the very top of this article?

      The problem isn't your eyesight. The problem is you have little or no knowledge regarding the occult world...all their covert signaling and symbols. It takes a bit of reading and study.

      The simple fact is...there ARE satanists in the world and they DO hide within the Christian community. It's a great hiding place. And the concept is in the Bible: ""Wolves in sheep's clothing". Strangely, you're objecting to a biblical concept.

      Delete
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    ReplyDelete
  17. Illuminati is no more conspiracy for those who opened their eyes and look the world they're living in. It's true that this secret society is using the christian music industry too.TobyMac's ILL-M-I and his album cover on the renovating diversity(all seeing eye)and his photos tell us the truth that he's illuminati. Normally we have to suspect something when Tobymac leads mixed life like singing "pants on the ground" on christian concert and opening a concert with Black eyed piece's music. Have you seen the album cover of Skillet's "Awake"? It's advertising the all seeing eye of lucifer. Anyways it's better to stick with Christ this time.

    ReplyDelete
  18. Just want to say I agree with what Jason Groenink said. Tobymac is reaching an audience that probably otherwise would have never heard the Gospel.
    Another thought: Where did Jesus spend his time? With the sinners, tax-collectors, and the like. He didn't avoid them and say, "Oh that must be where they do they're sinning; I'm not going there!" He met people where they are and gave hope and salvation to broken people. "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven." (Matt 5:3). Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  19. thedahlhouse--

    This is Matt TwoFour. If TobyMac's signalings of Luciferian allegiance are to be taken at face value...then who would he be "reaching" for Christ? If he's a Luciferian (and his published materials give every indication of such)...then he's "reaching" people for his dark lord and master.

    You have to read Jesus' warnings in the Olivet Discourse. He plainly states there will arise a large number of fake and satanic "Christian" leaders in the last days...for the purpose of luring Jesus-followers into apostasy.

    You say Jesus "gave hope and salvation to broken people". But He didn't help to prop them up as false Christian leaders. I'll meet with TobyMac at a cofffee shop and inform him about the evils of publicly pledging allegiance to Lucifer...and try to get him to repent. But I certainly wouldn't go to his concert and I would certainly point out to as many as possible, all the satanic symbolism displayed covertly on his CD covers and websites.

    ReplyDelete
  20. LutherRocks--

    This is Matt TwoFour responding.

    So...you think Lucado may be a deliberate wolf? Interesting. What gives you that impression? I guess if we want to be real 'conspiratorial'...the very name "Lucado" is somewhat dubious but I had never seen any direct indicators about Lucado. I know he toured with Michael Smith, Toby Mac and Third Day...all of whom are notorious for having occult-symbol-riddled CDs, web sites, and what-not.

    I like what I saw of your blog. How did you begin to realize there are all these bands with occult indicators? I was admiring your doggedness in counting all 111 beats in that Third Day song!

    ReplyDelete
  21. Watchman--

    I must've missed your previous post about Obama. No, I don't see any evidence about Obama. Don't see how Lk.10:18 is about Obama. (?) The "beast" must come from among the seven kings who reigned over the seven beast empires (Rev. 17:9-11). Unless, Obama headed up one of the beast empires, he is disqualified.

    Interesting to me is that Nazi Germany was apparently the 7th beast empire. The 7th hadn't yet occurred at the time of Revelation's writing, yet needed to occur before 1948 to make way for the eighth beast empire's (the Antichrist empire's) destruction of Israel.

    This would put Hitler in the running...and he died of a head wound (self-inflicted)...and the Nazi empire indeed lasted only a "little while" (a mere 12 years) compared to the previous six empires, per Revelation's description of the 7th.

    And think about it: Who would cause more of a traumatizing Stockholm Syndrome shock on the whole world...then if a 'resurrected' Hitler were to suddenly burst onto the scene? Food for thought.

    I have heard some very 'creative' theories...that Obama may have been cloned from an ancient pharoah. While I don't put it past these people (the Bible forewarns that the Antichrist cabal will be capable of staggeringly spectacular "signs and wonders"..and the news leaking from various nooks is that gene-manipulation tech has developed far beyond what is reported to the public)...

    ...I don't see where a mere 'announcement' that Obama is a pharoah clone would have this worldwide reaction of shock and awe...such as would a reappearance of Hitler.

    That's merely my 'leaning'. Theorizing regarding the identity of the Antichrist is not a critical issue. By the way, the whole Hitler theory comes from VanKampen's book "The Sign".

    ReplyDelete
  22. Yes, the US is still the world's greatest military power but...my understanding regarding US presidents is that Obama has no more control over the US military/industrial complex...then the White House chef.

    US presidents are hirelings. They are gofers...sock puppets. When David Rockefeller visits the White House, the President of the United States is the guy who fetches the coffee.

    Also...according to my info (read Webster Tarpley's book on Obama), the current prez is the most extremely mind-controlled Manchurian Candidate robot who has ever set foot in the Oval Office.

    The whole idea of a "muslim terrorist threat" is a Pentagon/Antichrist-cabal concoction. The muslim's worldwide arsenal consists of two donkeys, three camels, and a hand grenade (maybe throw in a few slingshots0. I exaggerate only slightly.

    Al Qaida is non-existent...a figment of the Cabal's imagination. The reporter for the latest PBS docu on Al Qaida came back from Afghanistan more or less admitting there is no such thing...other than a couple hundred dirt farmers with ancient AK47's who quite arbitrarily refer to themselves as "Al Qaida".

    A couple dozen ex CIA agents have also blown the whistle of the non-existing Al Qaida (http://blog.drkentshow.com/?p=2288).

    Personally, I have grave concerns about Perry Stone...a guy who regularly kicks up large clouds of confusing and unsubstantiated nonsense. Sorry...that's my take. Don't mean to offend!

    ReplyDelete
  23. Hi mate, i have just finished reading your online book. There is a lot of truth in what you say but and there is always a but :)but i think you have kind of wimped out regarding catholicism.

    Even although you spoke the truth you said it in an almost apologetic manner..........and you didnt go far enough.

    For instance when you spoke of Hitler and the second World War, you failed to mention he was a Vatican puppet, as were Stalin and Churchill.

    Talmudic Judaism and Catholic Christianity together are the synagogue of Satan and they control everything.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Nothing wrong with apologizing for hurting people's feelings. (?) It's always good to have a little sympathy. I'm not compromising on the message...I'm just commiserating with fellow victims of worldwide satanic infiltration. I went through a similar grieving process to find out that virtually all of my heroes and/or role models were either dupes or wolves. Tough pill to swallow.

      As far as Hitler being a puppet of the Antichrist cabal...go back a re-read maybe? I pointed all that out...discussed Hitler at length...and made clear my working theory that the Jesuits and Jesuit General appear to be the pinnacle of satanic world power.

      For anyone interested, see Chapter 15 of "Wolves In Sheep's Clothing".

      Delete
  24. I just popped on your blog today after a week-long "awakening" and am saddened to see some of my concerns about Toby Mac confirmed. My husband suspected the connection after reading his minimal response to the Illuminati question. If anything, he is not being vocal enough about these issues. These symbols are rampant in the hip hop industry. So many have “sold out” I would think he would have a commentary on the matter. I just checkout out the “me without you” song on You Tube and it also has some questionable symbols. Black, red, and white colors throughout and Targets throughout…..isn’t that also an occult symbol?….. (point within a circle???)
    I have been doing a ton of research on these symbols in the media…What they mean and the connection between Masonry and Satanism. I have been in a state of shock for the entire week. I feel as if my entire perception of life in general has been wrong and I have suddenly come out of the Matrix …… Everywhere I turn I see these symbols that were of no concern before……I can’t get away from it. I have completely eliminated Disney Channel for my children and have been more anxious than I have ever been. Afraid to look anywhere. Vigilant Citizen has been a great tool for learning as I had no idea about MK Ultra etc.….but all of this information is overload. I need to refocus!!!
    I pray every night for peace and I keep asking God why I have been AWOKEN now, at this time….what can I personally do….I feel like hiding in a hole, but I know that is not the answer. How come so many Christians are not aware of this stuff?????
    Blessings to you and thanks.

    PS. Bono was a HUGE blow to me as well this week as I used to think they were a good example of being a Christian in a secular band. After rewatching the YAWEH official video I was shocked at the blasphemy. How come I did not see that before?????…and all of that Co-exist stuff…. (Read Diversity Toby Mac???). I love-loved U2….and am a bit shocked and sad. He was promoting the message bible last I heard. Maybe I should toss my message in the trash?!

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  25. Can I ask if you think some of these people may be doing this unknowingly? I mean, even I own a checkered shirt but I'm not part of the illuminati. I'm not saying some of your points are not valid, but I also think we should be careful and not try to find evil everywhere especially through "symbols" that most people don't associate anything with, like the scrollwork on the Michael W. Smith album cover. I have separate issues with TobyMac's music (a lot of lyrics aren't glorifying to God, cult of personality and entertainment-focused instead of worship focused), but I don't think I can say it's some evil conspiracy either (apart from the evil inherent anytime the focus is on self or the world.) While I appreciate calling out wolves, I guess I just don't see the point in focusing on some secret society especially and it seems like something we could get too focused on. There is plenty of Scripture twisting and outright blasphemy going on unchecked in our churches apart from looking for symbols around every corner.
    Thank you for listening.

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  26. I'm the same anon as above.

    I just read through the portions of your ebook you referenced above and it answered my questions. I apologize for my hasty assumptions because it seems we agree on a lot of things and have a similar perspective. I will read the references first next time before I post something in haste. Good lesson.

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  27. Okay Matt, just saw Toby Mac's newest album cover. Guess what it is? Yup, a bit, giant EYE. Title - "Eye on It"

    I think we can now state that he knows and yes, Toby, we know too.

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    Replies
    1. Are you kidding me?? Wow. It almost feels personal. Do some of these guys see us discussing their covert luciferianism and then decide to kick it up a notch?

      It's interesting that though these occultists view us Red Pill onlookers as impotent losers (oh, the surprise that awaits)...they nevertheless keep their camouflage and coded signalings carefully in place.

      That's the glory of a Jesus-follower: We stand out in broad daylight as sheep among wolves, announcing our faith in Jesus. Those guys have to hide in the shadows.

      Yes, they will have their brief hey-day. They will throw many innocent people into the dungeons and the valley of death. But after only a couple or three years of their "New World Order", the festivities will be interrupted by the sound of a trumpet.

      Thanks for the 'heads up', Labby. I think I may add an "edit" paragraph about this latest CD cover. And I see he's naming his entire tour, "Eye On It".

      Delete
    2. I looked a little closer at some of the lyrics on his "Illuminati" song:

      “One day, I’m'a make the whole world pay” and “And if I miss with my missles you’re still gonna sizzle
      ‘Cause I frizzle fry radiation style worldwide”

      Well, isn't that lovely. He's right though. The Antichrist cabal is going to make the whole "pay" in a manner of speaking. And if they don't get everybody with brute military force...there's always HAARP and all the other creepy EM technologies they're going to implement...exactly as TobyMac seems to be bragging.

      Quite clearly, his lyrics are suggesting he is looking forward to becoming a hands-on mass murderer:
      "I frizzle fry..worldwide".

      I suppose if he was confronted directly in an interview about this (not likely in the discernment-free world of CCM)...he would claim "poetic license".

      Toby, Toby, Toby. Do you dream and fantasize about mass murder?

      Delete
  28. My wish for people who spend SO MUCH TIME AND EFFORT looking for symbolism on the surface, is that you would invest your efforts into witnessing to others the way tobyMac has. All you are going off of is a hunch. This man, in EVERY way, has devoted his life to spreading the Gospel through music. What evidence of any wrongdoing, other than your own skepticism, do you have?

    He has NEVER backed down from the Gospel. Use your efforts to do good!

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    Replies
    1. "Witnessing"? I sat down and read through the lyrics of twenty-three Toby Mac songs this evening. Not one single bit of Gospel presentation. You can't "witness" unless you're conveying the truth of the Gospel.

      You say he's "never backed down from the Gospel". OK--how do you actually define the Gospel? That's a pretty tricky question these days.

      Besides the fact that I can't find ANYWHERE in his lyrics that he has presented the Gospel in the first place (and I'm not saying he hasn't presented some sort of "pray a prayer to Jesus and go to heaven" comment in between songs)...

      ...there is the additional tragic fact that most people define the Gospel as...

      "pray a prayer, then join a PreTrib-by-default / 'Contemplative Prayer' occult-practicing / proud-as-a-peacock triumphalist Dominonist church group."

      Between the PreTrib deceptions, the occult practicing, and the Dominionism...the vast majority of today's fair weather "Christ-followers" are headed for apostasy and doom...per Jesus' explicit prediction.

      Jesus has prophesied (and I quote) "the love of most will grow cold...and only he who stands firm to the end will be saved."

      FYI--Wolves who have infiltrated Christian circles (whoever they may be) don't care WHO prays a little prayer...as long as they know they're corralling these sheep into apostasy during the last phases before the end.

      Delete
  29. Hello here! Just saying, someone posted a link to this page (That is how I discovered you) in Toby Mac's facebook post explaining his "why" of the big eye on the cover of the cd, and shortly after it was erased. Interesting, if he didn't have anything to hide, why erase it?
    By the way, I like your blog and I'm gonna read your book. Thanks for all the info you post. I'll keep coming back.

    Linda.

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    Replies
    1. Wow--that's pretty spooky. You're absolutely right: If we're all brothers and sisters here...and if people are concerned and have questions as to why a prominent CCM artist is using obvious satanic symbolism...why wouldn't the concerns be addressed? Instead, they erase (he erases) the entire comment??

      All Toby Mac would need to do to clear the air is produce a short Youtube video in which he personally appears (so that we could see HE was the one making the actual comment) in which he clearly repudiates Lucifer (aka the Devil, Satan, Tyr, Amaruca, etc.) as the biggest loser in the universe and who has been utterly and completely defeated at the cross of Calvary through the shed blood of Jesus...and that Lucifer will be sent to the eternal fires of Hell where he rightly belongs. A comment along those lines would be a good start.

      But I would want to see him pinned down on the actual term "Lucifer" and a few other satanic aliases, just to cover the bases. Occultists are notorious for playing word games.

      Then TobyMac could start removing all the occult symbolism.

      Thanks for the good words, by the way. Keep me posted on the Facebook thing, if you like. I don't do Facebook at this point.

      Delete
    2. Today's FB update from Toby Mac on 7/28:

      TobyMac
      about an hour ago
      Come on ya'll :) My EYE remains on our Lord Jesus and the calling He has placed on my life. To build His Kingdom through my life and music. "Eye on it" is simply a phrase used to mean "stay focused on what really matters." To me, my relationship with Christ and the calling He has placed on my life is what matters to me and what I am trying to keep my eye on! In Love, Tmac



      I am just amazed at this because it all seems so "in your face", doesn't it? I mean, this eye symbolism is all over the place and getting worse, and then a Christian artist who knows what people think of it clearly doesn't care about all of that and puts it boldly out there almost to mock, it would seem. It's not like it's the first time he's been suspected of occult symbolism.

      What does the Bible say about keeping away from even the appearance of evil?

      Abstain from all appearance of evil. I Thess. 5:22

      Delete
    3. I agree with you. With no disrespect intended towards anyone...nevertheless, I have to state this frankly:

      Forging ahead with his arbitrarily concocted definition of satanic eye symbolism...is just plain obnoxious. And ridiculous. And illiterate.

      There isn't a good excuse on the face of the earth for utilizing satanic symbolism. Not to mention the gargantuan context Toby Mac has created with numerous other presentations of satanic symbolism on his previous CD covers.

      He might have a slim chance of arguing he has only "coincidentally" chosen a satanic symbol...if this were the first time. It ain't the first time.

      Also keep in mind--occultists' penchant for playing slippery word games. If a reference to the "Eye" is a reference to Lucifer...then "eye on it" means the Devil is 'on it' or 'on top of it'. In other words, he is seen to be predominant...towering above his enemies. Lucifer's enemy is the Lord God Almighty...a very, very poor choice of enemy.

      Thanks for the 'heads up'. I wish we had an army of folks to pile on to Toby Mac's Facebook...and force some real accountability. Alas...most of the believers are asleep.

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  30. You say this:
    "Notice the (Masonic) black and white checkered shirt."

    What do you think the black and white checker pattern (in shirts, on floors, or otherwise) alludes to in you're understanding of the Masonic/Satanic symbolism? What power does it give a mason? What is the symbolism saying?

    Curious, at what point does a checker pattern go from a simple design to something "Satanic"? An apple displays the sacred geometry of a pentagram, sounds like nature is Satanic.....maybe it is.

    Sure, it's ok to talk about eating the flesh and drinking the blood of a God-man, that's normal, celebrated and even sacred in the church...but heaven forbid (pun always intended) I walk out of the house with a checkered shirt on, that's just vile. Haha ;-)

    Communion is weird to outsiders, it's supposed to be...but when you're a Christian it speaks volumes that someone on the outside simply can't understand. Maybe you just need to go shopping at Old Navy and get a feel of what that flannel feels like against your skin.

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    1. OK, OK...calm down now. By the way--when did I give the "ok" to talk about "eating flesh and drinking blood"? I believe in no such thing. The communion exercise, where we eat a bit of cracker and a small sip of grape juice to commemorate Jesus' act of salvation...is that what you're referring to?

      Yes, I'm sure there are all kinds of mildly startling 'culture gaps' all over the place. Are we all supposed to ceaselessly apologize to each other's subcultures...because someone may not quite understand all the in's and out's of a particular way of life?

      Seems a bit silly..but by all means, begin apologizing to me for any potentially disconcerting aspects of your personal culture and choices. I'll be standing by. :)

      For example, I'm always a bit jolted when I see some young person who has pierced their earlobe with a 2 inch diameter pipe.

      But it would never occur to me, as it apparently has to you...to try to disrespect their subcultural orientation. I would hate to be mistaken (a concern you apparently do not share?) for being some sort of legalistic "church lady" (for you younger folks who don't get the reference, google "church lady, SNL").

      I'm a fundamentalist Bible-believing Christian...yet I have dozens and dozens of friends and acquaintances who are gay, bi-, tri-, tranny, pagan, pierced, tatted, you-name-it.

      So you may have pegged me incorrectly...just a tad. :)

      And no...to answer your (intentionally dumb?) question...one does not automatically become a satanist when one puts on a flannel shirt. But thanks for asking.

      But to answer your earlier and seemingly more serious question ("...at what point does a checker pattern go from a simple design to something Satanic?")...it's all about CONTEXT. Maybe you need to re-read the article? I went to great lengths to establish...context.

      When the guy has previously flashed numerous occult symbols...and is flashing the apparent "Lion's Paw" salute...one begins to theorize (not "conclude dogmatically") about the black and white symbolism.

      Here's a basic reality check: There ARE occultists in the world. Occultists DO display occult signalings and symbols. Hello? Your apparent position...that occult-symbol-flashing is something akin to belief in unicorns....uh, I don't get it. Sorry.

      And if the Devil has plagiarized designs in God's creation to create his symbols...it's quite illogical to say this is proof for satanism. What came first--the starfish or the pentagram? Come on now.

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    2. Let's establish context then. When you say occult, what do you mean? What is occult? You seem to imply "evil" into its definition, what makes you do that?

      As far as I can tell, "occult" simply means hidden or to hide, which is common to all the mysteries, even the mystery of Christianity. Jesus himself said he deliberately hides (we could say, occults) the mysteries of the Kingdom from people...have you ever considered why?

      I admire your passion for the truth and encourage you to keep digging, but remember, anybody can dig and find dirt, it takes skill to dig and find rare precious stones.

      Jesus is indeed the Logos and Light of God my friend and "they" thought he was a devil, so they crucified him. Jesus died on the cross for all, there's no longer a need to continue nailing more people to it.

      Perhaps start with taking Toby Mac and Michael W Smith off of it. It's a lot less work to set people free than it is to nail hands and feet and hoist them in the air to just watch them die slow, painful and gruesome deaths.

      The "fundamental" truth of the bible is freedom right?

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    3. Wait a minute--you left the reservation waaay back in your previous post when you theorized that God's creation is..."maybe satanic".

      You then dig the hole even deeper when you feign as though the definition for the word "occultism' isn't routinely settled among conservative orthodox Christians. To answer your (pardon my bluntness) fake question--among Bible-believers, "occultism" is routinely understood to be a reference to satanism.

      Yes, the root meaning of the word is "hidden" or "secret". It still doesn't change the simple fact that "occultism" is a commonly understood reference to satanism for conservative Christians.

      The fact that you're trying to create "uncertainty" about a common term like this is very, very odd. Combined with your open musings about God's creation being satanic...were you wanting to be mistaken for an occultist yourself? After all, who else would be open to the idea of God's creation being satanic?

      Sorry but...you lost me at "satanic".

      And the oddness continues...strangely patronizing comments, supposedly "encouraging" me to continue with my blog efforts, while in the very next sentence you say I am undertaking the "gruesome" task of "nailing" people to a cross. You need to figure out whether you're coming or going, no?

      And since you seem to be putting a fatherly arm around my shoulder...maybe you could advise me: If the Bible tells us (Jesus tells us) to be on the look-out for satanic wolves who will infiltrate the flock...how would you suggest we go about this? How strong would the evidence have to be before you would say--"Uh oh, I think this guy might be a wolf"??

      Here I'm thinking (dummy me!) if a guy has wallpapered his publications with hundreds of satanic symbols...maybe I should start a blog and warn some people about it?

      Maybe you have a better plan. I'm all ears. How many wolves have you spotted? The Bible has warned there will be these spectacularly concealed and disguised wolves among the flock. Jesus said a veritable army of these wolves will emerge in these last days.

      Go ahead and obey the Scripture's command to be on the look-out: Point out to us even a single well-known Christian leader who is widely believed to be genuine yet is satanic behind the scenes.

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    4. By the way--just a quick question: Do you renounce/denounce/repudiate Lucifer? Do you uphold Jesus as the great Victor who utterly defeated Lucifer (Tyr, Satan, and whatever other AKA he goes by) at the cross of Calvary...and that Lucifer is headed for the fires of Hell where he rightly belongs? Just wondering..after that "satanic" comment.

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    5. I am encouraging you to keep digging and looking (some call it "knocking"). I encourage your passion and dedication. However, I would discourage hitting people over the head with the shovel as you dig :-)

      Perhaps I would also recommend a good pair of protective glasses that would help keep dirt and other specks out of your eye as you look for the treasure so you can see clearly in your pursuit.

      Again, I remind you, the religious people of the day thought Jesus was Satan. It can get very complicated once you step outside the walls of your skin and try to analyze other people's hearts and intent. We each have a whole flock of sheep and a den of wolves in our own hearts we have to deal with. If you seek those out with the same intensity I think you'll find enough to keep you busy for a very long time (I know its kept me busy!). Now that would be an awesome blog idea!

      Let's not forget the truth "there is none else beside Him". We don't have to be scared.

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    6. Uh...what? Your comments are very oddly 'non sequitur'. And the patronizing style is just a bit silly, don't you think? Come on now.

      Again, once you opened the door to Satan in your initial comments, and pointedly expressed receptiveness to the idea that God's creation is "satanic"...your credibility obviously dropped to zero. Actually, below zero.

      So...I'm not sure what you think you're accomplishing here. You say you want to "encourage" me. But as someone who is, at the least, seriously contemplating the validity of satanism...I'll probably want to look for "encouragement" from other sources, if you don't mind.

      Meanwhile, if you ever want to lower yourself to the level of us mere mortals and answer some of the simple questions I posed, I'll be here.

      I'd be particularly interested in seeing you repudiate Lucifer and make it clear you share my desire to see him sent to a fiery eternal judgment.

      To me it is obvious you 'marked' yourself with the "satanic" remarks and a couple of other creepy expressions.

      Isn't it interesting that with some people's philosophies...they simply cannot speak straight and openly...cannot answer direct questions...have a need utilize double-talk...code talk...to veil...to misdirect. They simply cannot bring their views, their values, nor their beliefs out into the light of day...yet ironically, they claim to be the "illuminated" ones. Isn't that a pretty miserable existence? And no wonder the Lord God "sits in the heavens and laughs".

      Since we're "encouraging" each other...I'd encourage you to pull out of your "satanic" nosedive. You're headed for Solid Rock.

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    7. By mentioning that the apple reveals a pentagram was my quippy effort to show that nature is the origin of all these symbols. As man discovered these symbols and their mysteries they adopted them and worked with them in order to reveal the truths of creation and the Creator.

      Which is why I asked at the beginning...why is the checkered floor a symbol in masonry? What are some of the allusions? And at what point does it become evil? What does evil mean, what is the quality of evil? Because one man's evil is another man's victory.

      Do I repudiate Lucifer? I don't know what image of Lucifer you have in your head, but I can assume what it may be and to that I would say, yes. I don't like evil or manipulation any more than you do. I want freedom, love and acceptance.

      I imagine my understanding of Satan differs from yours just like my understanding of God, the bible and religion is different than yours, however, the language we use is the same. That's why it's better to go a little bit deeper and discuss the quality of these things...what are they at their essence?

      So, if we want to talk about Satan. We really can't because that one title means different things to different people. So then we go deeper, we may not agree on the actual specifics of Satan, but we can agree that Satan represents evil. That narrows things down a bit. Ok, so what's evil? Obviously me and you have different ideas of what evil is so we can't stop there. Lets go deeper. What does evil represent? Well, maybe a good start would be fear. Now I bet we can come to terms with that. I know I've been fearful before, and I bet you have too. No matter what makes up those fears, I bet we find that the FEELING of fear is the same for both you and I. And that's where we see each other as equals and actually talk about the real issues that exist right now and in this moment, not speculating on other individuals we will never know or have a chance to understand.

      This is why when the lawyer asked Jesus "Who is my neighbor?" Jesus never gave him the answer directly...he told him a STORY and then asked "Who was the neighbor to whom?", so that he could actually feel the revelation of the answer.

      Admittedly, I am playing around and having fun a bit, I probably shouldn't do that at your expense and I apologize. But if we continue to talk about what color tombs should be painted we'll just keep spinning our wheels. So I ask...what is the point? Who cares what pose Toby Mac is in today? Jesus wasn't emotionally wrapped up in the games Pharisees played, he had confidence in knowing that noone had control over his life (or any of his flock for that matter) that he didn't allow. He had purpose and his one mission was to complete the task at hand not get caught up by distractions...

      Ok full disclosure...I'm just projecting anyway haha. I feel like I can relate to you and what you're saying. I had a blog and wrote content in a similar vein. I had a shoebox full of "documents" detailing how satanic Masonry and everything else under the sun was. So, I get it...

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    8. OK so...you ARE luciferian. You only reject the "Lucifer" that exists in my twisted 'misinformed' thinking...but do not reject the real Lucifer..the actual person of Lucifer, who exists apart from 'Christian distortions'. Alrighty then.

      Don't know why it takes you guys forever to cough up simple information like this. Like I said, philosophies (such as yours, apparently) that have to twist and turn and wriggle and writhe and weasel and worm....oy vey, I'm getting worn out just thinking about it. Maybe you should lay down and take a nap after this?

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    9. I don't know what a luciferian is. I'm not positive I understand what the bible was talking about when it talks about the Morning Star. Consequently, I'm not entirely sure if I understand the intent of the gospel stories.

      The truth is, I'm a normal guy seeking for the truth of who I am and what I'm doing here. I have a family, a job, my primary goal is to love the Creator, love myself and love my neighbor. In my pursuit I've realized things aren't as black and white as I once perceived as a conservative christian. I don't think that makes me evil. I don't want anything different for you than I want for anybody else...peace, love and freedom. I personally don't care what you label that as.

      It's fun for me to discuss these things, I don't take them personally, I think it helps to encourage me to think outside of the box. I know God loves me and wants good things for me...and in knowing that, I know that God is a better Father than I am a son and he's not scared of my questions. So there really isn't anything to be afraid of, especially black and white tiled floors...

      I feel I've addressed your questions. Would you mind just answering one of mine? What does the checkered floor represent in masonry? What power does it give the mason? And what makes it evil?

      BTW...further disclosure...hahaha I am actually wearing a checkered shirt today, though it's black and dark gray.

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    10. OK so now you claim (in so many words) you've just been 'pranking'? For somebody who is now describing themselves as having no certainty about anything...you've certainly been dogmatically conclusive about how wrongful I supposedly am in pointing out wolves within the flock. How does that work?

      You now say you don't even "know what a luciferian is" yet you're rather vehemently opposed to anyone who objects to satanic signalings and symbols...things you're now claiming you have no understanding of? I don't get it.

      I'm finding it a bit difficult to buy into your latest incarnation as Mr. Universal Dumb Guy. For example, you say you were once a participant in mainstream "conservative Christianity"...yet you also say you have no clue what a luciferian is. OK...that claim is a bit dubious.

      I think a 10-year old with 6 months Sunday School experience could give a basic explanation of "luciferianism". A "luciferian" would be a guy who follows Lucifer. Lucifer is the 'bad guy' in the Bible. He's the one who does all the evil things. There are people in this world who follow Lucifer. They're luciferians. I think you're 'pranking' has continued into these latest posted comments of yours, maybe?

      Not sure what you want from me. You initially make comments which slyly suggest you're not opposed to Satan...and which you're now more or less admitting was intentionally obnoxious and discourteous on your part...as it was meant to trigger the alarm bells of a Bible-believer like myself. And so, after said alarm bells are triggered, you then ran away laughing...but later came back apologizing...yet with additional 'pranking' elements still observable in your latest comments?

      Assuming now that you WERE just 'pranking' with your handful of coy, tongue-in-cheek remarks..I think you therefore need to let me know when 'play time' is over. You're still making remarks to the effect that "whoops, I'm wearing a satanic checkered shirt...hahaha..lol". You're coming off as flip and glib...arrogant, basically.

      And now this "rabbi, I have a question" schtick?? 5 minutes ago (give or take) you're describing me as brutally, savagely "nailing" people to a cross...viciously hammering people over the head with a "shovel"...but all of a sudden I'm a fount of wisdom and you're sitting there with a notepad ready to catch my pearls of wisdom and insight?

      I think maybe you need a 'time-out'.

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    11. First of all, I'm not pranking, I'm serious but I'm not SO serious and I'm just having fun while Im doing it.

      I don't know what YOU mean by luciferian. I can say I boldly follow the bright morning star. But what does that mean to you? You could read it either way you wanted.

      This is why I keep asking you about the checkered floor...I'm trying to understand where you're coming from. I've asked quite a few times now with no response whatsoever. What does the checkered floor allude to? What power does it give a mason? What makes it evil? How do you determine if a check pattern is there for design or for evil?


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    12. Anonymous guy: " I can say I boldly follow the bright morning star."

      OK so...you ARE luciferian. Again, the circuitous-ness must wear you out. Have a seat. You're looking a little pale.

      Let's compare a couple of your quotes:

      #1-- "Admittedly, I am playing around and having fun a bit, I probably shouldn't do that at your expense and I apologize."

      #2-- "First of all, I'm not pranking..."

      Somewhere along the line, you've become confused, no?

      And you're getting pretty pointed about me not answering your questions. Howzabout you answer MY questions? You completely brushed aside an entire set of my comments where I have challenged you to show me how we should follow Jesus' instructions about keeping a look-out for satanic wolves who infiltrate God's "flock".

      You had issued these wildly judgmental 'church lady'-like indictments about me...that I'm crucifying folks and attacking them with shovels. So I asked you to advise me. All I got was the sound of crickets.

      I think the problem here is...either you're luciferian and wanting to play some games with me...OR, you're so willy-nilly all over the landscape when it comes to what you believe or don't believe...that it is really nigh unto impossible to have a conversation with you. For example, I ask you if you repudiate Lucifer. You come back with this silly "what is a Lucifer? Is it a vegetable, a mineral, a star...?"

      If you're truly a seeker...you need to go back to square one. You can start with the Intro and chapters 1 and 2 of my book "Wolves In Sheep's Clothing". The link is at the top of this page.

      You seem to barely be able to suppress giggling about all of this, to hear you describe yourself. Skip to my chapters 7 and 8 which detail the horrible evils of upper echelon satanists in America...then see if you still feel like coming back here and typing out "hahaha" and "lol".

      I don't get this whole thing about the intense interest in the checkering. Again, why would you want insights from me? You had already determined I'm merely some sort of ranting lunatic. You want me to explain Masonic symbolisms? Why wouldn't you just google for about 5 minutes? The topic is really too involved for this little comment forum.

      The black and white represents the split personality of satanists. They believe in having a evil side and a good side for the purpose of balance, so they don't lose their minds.

      Virtually all satanists/luciferians are split...dissociated. They believe they need this in order to not come unraveled...from the horrendous evils they engage in...satanic ritual abuse, wall-to-wall pedophilia, torture, murder, satan worship.

      Again, chapters 7 and 8...particularly 8...many details about these things...if you're truly interested. Read through it and get back to me...unless you're a "bold follower" of Lucifer.

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    13. Maybe I'll check out your book sometime. It's been a pleasure exchanging ideas with you. I'd love to keep going but I doubt it's going to be fruitful for either of us. I wish you well friend.

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    14. Hmmm. Calling me "friend" when you haven't been very friendly...a little odd, I think. The crazily judgmental indictments involving "crucifixions" and shovel attacks when you afterward admit to having not so much as Clue One about the subject matter...I would say you seem very confused at best.

      But you have also made a number of statements that again, AT BEST, seemed obnoxiously calculated to cause concerns over your potential "satanic" status. The bizarre stand-alone sentence "I can say I boldly follow Lucifer". Again, seems intentionally obnoxious, at best.

      Then...your waffling on the question of whether you oppose Satan. If you're not even sure of Lucifer's literal existence, then just say so. But no, you do this weird twisty "the-Lucifer-in-your-mind" pseudo-non-answer thingy. Again, either obnoxious or you are what you repeatedly indicated--luciferian.

      And your (pardon my bluntness) illiterate notions about the word "occult" being universally viewed simply as a generic term referring only to "secrecy"...pure (intentional?) nonsense and an argument I have previously only ever heard from occultists. If you are non-occultist, then you'd be the first to make this erroneous claim about a term which is universally understood to refer to the non-Christian/anti-Christian realm.

      And given all your other claims of agnosticism on a variety of issues throughout our little discussion...it's a bit conspicuous and odd that you, all of a sudden, have this very definitive argument about the the word "occult".

      Of course, the same is true about your trumpeted denunciations regarding my attempts to warn Toby Mac fans about his coded, camouflaged occult signaling: You basically admit to understanding 'zilch' about the matter but it didn't stop the 'authoritative' denunciations. So then...you're "ignorant and agnostic" when it serves the purpose...yet 'dogmatically authoritative' whenever the situation requires it? Good grief.

      Then you press and press for my explanations about 'checkering' even though, in pure ignorance (self-admitted), you reject and denounce my OTHER identifications and explanations of occult symbols(concerns about Toby Mac's satanic "EYE"). I don't get it.

      So I give you a brief run-down finally and...pffft. Nothing. No 'thanks'. No comment. (?)

      If you're prone to apologies...maybe another one is in order...for forcefully imposing your profound ignorance when I'm simply trying to save some of these kids from satanic Pied Pipers who are sprinkled throughout the world of contemporary Christian music.

      I would compare it to some random passer-by motorist stopping to see a crash on the highway and ignorantly elbowing his way in front of the medics and the cops who are trying to handle an extreme emergency situation.

      The Devil is trying to drag these kids straight through the gates of hell...and if you yourself happen to live in some kind of ignorance-is-bliss happy-happy 'American Dream' bubble...then at least read through the EMT training manual before you step in front of the medics at the crash site.

      No offense taken, no upset going on here but...to be frank, you've tried to elbow your way in front of me with your 'church lady' denunciations...and then admit you don't have a clue what you're talking about. My grandma always use to tell me "whenever you want to say something, first count to ten". I think you forgot to count.

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    15. Maybe I was wrong...do you find this dialogue fruitful? What are your goals in the exchange? Do you feel you will meet them using your current methods? Would you prefer to carry on?

      I just wanted to throw out some questions (some rhetorical) about the subject matter because I feel you are looking at it from a particular (dark) perspective and that there are other ways to look at it without being deemed a Satanist/Luciferian.

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    16. Maybe it was just pure misfortune but,..there were 2 or 3 times where you seemed to utilize absolutely classic occult-style 'word games' which turned my alarm bells on. That and the very aggressive indictments about me "crucifying" and attacking people with shovels, when I'm merely trying to rescue kids (I've got two teenagers of my own) from what I clearly perceive to be satanic charlatans parading as "Christian"...it has made for a very stiff, blunt exchange between us.

      But the more you come back in the manner in which you have just now...the more I am of the mind that "oh well, occultist or not...if he would like to have a pleasant debate/discussion, fine by me".

      I'm not concluding you ARE an occultist but...like I said, you had made a few statements that were dead-ringers for many previous arguments coming from occultists with whom I've conversed. I suppose your attempts at "devil's advocacy" (inadvertent pun) could potentially explain why some of your comments seemed so occult-like.

      Anyway...absolutely...throw out any questions or topics you choose. I think for me..the first thing I would try to ascertain is...what exactly is your bedrock? What are your basic beliefs and/or non-beliefs...compared to mine?

      If, for example, you draw up well short of accepting the whole of the Bible in a literal, historical, grammatical fashion...then, we would have to start any discussion further back into the basic questions.

      For example, you seemed somehow to have obtained a confident belief that God loves you and that you should be fulfilling His standards in some form or fashion. By contrast, you seemed to feel quite free to all but dispose of the literal concept of Satan/Lucifer. Some issues to sort out there.

      It may seem for the moment that I have a 'dark perspective' when dealing directly with the matter of satanic wolves who are deliberately targeting young people. My "big picture" however...is absolutely and utterly fantastic:

      I am expecting the return of the King in the very near future (after a brief period of intense upheaval)...the end of the age of man and the beginning of the never-ending "age of God". A home in the New Jerusalem, per the Bible's promises...no more death, disease, pain, troubles, burdens, separations...surrounded by a sea of brothers and sisters, in the very presence of the King of Kings, the Lord Jesus Himself...on and on and on.

      But yes, I believe we are living on Planet Titanic for the moment. The world is going down for the count, and the Devil is closing in with his master plan...however brief his hey-day will turn out to be.

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    17. Awesome! I think we've hit a note of harmony here.

      I myself am a father of 2 (under the age of 10) and I only want good for them. I want them to live in a place of peace and freedom. It doesn't exist yet, but I want to do my part.

      You're right though, I could be considered an occultist (I am in fact a Mason - dont run away yet...I wouldnt consider myself a Luciferian or Satanist, because I don't worship satan. I'm for the good side.). But the problem is, we have 2 opposing definitions of what that means to each of us and what it implies, and I think that's where the real issue is, thats where the dialogue needs to be. Maybe a better, more palatable term would be an [amateur] esoteric...but I think Christianity is an esoteric mystery as well if we really look at it.

      God is wonderfully complex and massive, there is nothing else besides him as a matter of fact, all things work for and through Him. So we must be patient, considerate and gracious with one another as we try to figure out exactly what's really going on here. I don't think it's so black and white (pun intended) and set in stone (twofer).

      I no longer consider myself a traditional christian, however, I do believe I have a closer relationship with God than I ever had. The bible is more real to me now and His kingdom is more spectacular than I ever imagined. I used to be a street preacher and I would literally stand on sidewalks in front of gas stations and preach the gospel of the kingdom of God to people. I don't any more because my relationship with God has change and evolved...but I think that's supposed to happen. No person or relationship stays the same. Consider the change from OT to NT.

      So it's hard to judge correctly by these means (the internet) but it's much easier to judge, we must be patient with one another as we learn new ways to understand the heart and intent of the person on the other side of the screen. I'd be more than willing to speak very openly about what I believe and have a genuine discussion to see if there might be a common ground on which we could stand. I'm fairly confident that could be attained. (this comment thread may not be the most appropriate avenue though)

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    18. Ok so...for openers, do you believe in the literal existence of Lucifer and agree with the Bible's designation of him as the eptiome of evil? You seem to be relying on SOME kind of information from the Bible. Do you sort of pick and choose, in other words?

      The friendlier tone is certainly nice but (and I also say this in a friendlier tone) I have to insist that the way in which you are taught to communicate evasively, with the bobbing, weaving and dodging...is for me, inappropriate. You subject the other person with whom you are conversing, to consternation and alarm. This is coming from Freemason culture. All due respect, you folks have no moral authority nor appropriate grounds for the endless circuitous-ness and secrecy. Basically, it's just impolite...even though that seems not be your deliberate intention. It's just a side effect of Freemason business-as-usual.

      Regardless of what you believe is appropriate...it is NOT appropriate for Toby Mac to be secretly indicating secret, occult (and for me, satanic) allegiances. That is NOT acceptable in terms of orthodox Bible-based Christianity.

      The agenda of Freemasonry does not trump the agenda of the Lord Jesus. This is where I become frustrated with most Masons' utter lack of common sense discernment...that they will try to somehow argue it is OK for Toby Mac to covertly signal allegiances under the noses of the Christian teenagers who unaware of this.

      Mac is in fact HEADLINING his occult allegiances with his latest CD which features a gigantic Masonic/occultic/satanic all-seeing-eye...which takes up the whole cover of the CD. (Did you see my latest Toby Mac article?)

      If you're supposedly trying to get young people to uphold Jesus as their Lord and Savior and as the King of Kings...you don't "headline" some bizarre invisible allegiance. Again, the frustrating lack of common sense discernment from Freemasons...as to just how creepy, inappropriate and anti-biblical such behavior is.

      As I said, Freemasons (such as Toby Mac, apparently) have no appropriate grounds for covertness and secrecy...nor has any single, solitary rank-and-file Mason (such as yourself?) EVER been able to explain what actual purpose all of their secrecy serves.

      As far as the rank-and-file are concerned, the secrecy serves NO particular purpose...other than that it's "kind of fun". Oy vey. The rank-and-file Masons I have had conversations with, invariably concede (however indirectly) that's it's really just Dungeons-and-Dragons (or Pokemon)..for older people.

      You folks are of course HUGELY fond of pointing out Jesus' parables were not understood by some. But there was a specific and understandable purpose in that very narrowly defined scenario: If and when Jesus had discerned and foreknown his listeners would REJECT the truth...then, out of mercy, He veiled the truth so as not to worsen their future judgment.

      Freemasons can claim no such purpose...nor do they limit the veiled-ness to any such narrowly defined scenario...NOR (as I said) can any rank-and-file Masons actually EXPLAIN the purpose of Masonic secrecy.

      Mac's satanic symbol flashing is an utter violation of orthodox biblical principles...and an utter violation of the Bible's mandate to "avoid all appearance of evil".

      I don't know if you would try to deny this obvious reality but...for many people, occultism is the means by which they conceal hardcore satanism. Personally, I believe ALL occultism is at least an inadvertent participation in Luciferianism...and I don't see how anyone can miss the clues:

      If all the symbols and signals are the same..what's the difference?

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    19. Please understand this. I'm no taught to communicate in any particular way in Masonry. Also, don't allow me to speak on behalf of all of Masonry, I can only speak of my journey and my experience. I communicated like this when I was a Christian...it's just my style. And I do agree with you, sometimes it is insensitive, disrespectful and rude. Especially if you don't know me...and I don't know you. My intent in communicating in this way is to incite dialogue and thinking outside of the box. I figured you were capable of batting back and forth a bit by reading your article so I probably hit a little harder than I probably should have, at least initially ;-).

      I would love to answer all your questions, it helps me better understand myself and others. It's hard to figure out exactly which to address because you squeeze a lot in a reply, so if I can suggest, please try and make it clear, concise and to the point.

      I believe we must achieve a point of peace and unity rather than division (Im speaking of the world), and that's my goal, to do my part.

      Me and you are different, but there are aspects of us which are the same, and those are the qualities that we must speak to and communicate with. You may like chinese food and I like mexican, but we both enjoy the quality of eating our favorite food regardless of what it actually is in reality. I feel those are the points that we must accentuate and the surface "corporeal" manifestations need to decrease.

      So, again, you can ask me all the questions you want, but understand that's where I'm coming from and where I will always lead the conversation towards...what are we REALLY talking about here. That was why I brought up the pentagram in the apple. If a "Satanist" uses it for evil, yet it's a natural expression of nature...then what is the gap between the two? I ask myself, what is the significance of geometry? Why all these symbols? And in my journey I've found some very surprising [partial] answers. These answers actually bring unity rather than division, they instigate love, acceptance, and freedom, not fear.

      Are there ignorant dark people out there that hijack these truths...of course. Just like there are those that kill in the name of Jesus. We have to learn to look beyond the expression of these things and to the heart of where they come from and why. At least in my opinion.

      I hope that explains where I'm coming from a bit better and provides a little context. I can't address everything you said in your comment, because this is already running long, but I will answer your first question.

      Do I believe in a literal Lucifer?

      First of all, when I was playing loose with words earlier saying I follow the bright morning star I was alluding to the fact that Lucifer means morning star and Jesus refers to himself as morning star as well. So things aren't so black and white.

      I can't fully define what in fact I believe Satan to be...I can define the quality of what I believe he represents or is...and that is ultimately a resistance. A resistance to everything we know to perceive to be good...or God. I do not believe he's best represented as a singular superhuman evil being with a red tail.

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    20. OK well...bottom line, I'm following the Bible's instructions to be on the look-out for satanic wolf predators who infiltrate the "flock".

      Unfortunately, you're coming from a place very far off...where folks don't so much as distinguish between the word "Lucifer" and the word "Jesus", apparently?

      To claim you're not sure if Isaiah 14 may possibly be referring to the Lord Jesus...I mean, that's beyond ridiculous (pardon me)...starting with the fact that Lucifer's evils are being there described. Not to mention that he is actually named in the passage...Freemasonry's conveniently "creative" translations notwithstanding.

      Again, yes...this is classic occult belief and virtually indistinguishable from luciferianism. If Jesus is Lucifer and Lucifer is Jesus as you are suggesting...then why are you so coy about admitting luciferian allegiances?

      Again, you're disavowing any "training" from Freemasonry. OK, but...I don't know what to tell you---the circuitous-ness, the elliptical-ness...it's neverending. I'm just being frank.

      I certainly don't mind discussions but...you're so far off in a different belief world..that this is sort of like trying to explain the concept of "infiltrating satanists"...to an atheist. You think Bible believers are these silly people who believe the Devil has a "red tail" and that we believe we eat human flesh and drink blood for communion. No wonder you're 'chuckling' at my consternation over Toby Mac's ultra-creepy veiled/coded symbol flashing!

      You say there are "ignorant, dark people...who are hijacking the truth". Which "truth" is that exactly? I would say that after a while the argument fails. It's one thing to say people have done evil in the name of Christianity. It's quite another thing to argue "the bad Nazis ruined everything for the good Nazis".

      In other words, after seeing 4000 tons of evidence of the horrors and evils of occultism over the past ten years, I see no "good" side to occultism. You were hoping for common ground between biblical Christianity and occultism. Sorry but...there IS no common ground, from my information.

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    21. Just alone the fact that Masons cannot (or will not, as the case may be) explain the PURPOSE of their secrecy...it's "game over" from the standpoint of orthodox Christianity.

      "We're secretive but we're not going to tell you why". Uh...OK. Please cancel my Masonic membership, pronto! :(

      We have a veritable platoon of sneaky symbol-flashers who are slithering into the Christian community and into Christian music...and they are stealthily indicating secret, covert allegiances. The Bible warns of "wolves in sheep's clothing" who do such things...and I'm trying to give believers a 'heads-up'.

      If you are, as you say, more of a 'seeker' than a defender/backer of Freemasonry...in some kind of 're-evaluation' mode...by all means, read through some portions of my ebook...particularly chs.7,8,11 and 12. By the time you get through seeing the evidence of the horrors of upper echelon 'secret society' people...the "happy-happy sunshine" public relations image of Freemasonry is long, long gone. Don't know what else to tell you.

      This is, again, where I complain about a lack of common discernment among Masons I've talked to who are unable to provide a reason for Masonic secrecy:

      You folks should know better. I'll provide the answer I've never been able to get from any Mason: Human nature being what it is (tragically flawed and easily corrupted)...what other PURPOSE for secrecy, shadows, concealment, evasiveness, opaqueness...is there other than evil? I believe that to be common sense.

      Why, for example, do Michael W. Smith and Toby Mac sneak occult symbolism under the noses and behind the backs of their fans? For evil. What other purpose could there be?

      It is absolute evil for these guys to dishonestly sneak messages past their Christian audience. There is no wiggle room. The Bible is abundantly clear on this...from about a hundred different angles.

      By the way, leave TWO posts if you need the space. Time permitting, I'd really like to hear answers to the number of questions you haven't addressed.

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    22. Let's talk about secrecy for a few then. Again, I preface this with saying that this is my understanding and my opinion. I don't and cannot speak for Masonry, just of my limited experience.

      First of all I would say that in reality, the "secrets" of masonry aren't too secretive when you really consider it. First of all, I was a completely random guy off the street, I didn't even know a mason, just called my local lodge and chatted with the secretary there, did a short interview and all of the sudden I was accepted.

      They're not stingy with the "secrets", theres just a protocol...which is the point. I see it more as a protective concealment than the connotation of secrecy. It's the concept of not casting your pearls before the swine. It's a protection of the sacred from the profane and that's really one of the primary qualities of the secrecy.

      Obviously, the "secrets" aren't too secretive if you can find them all over the internet and in books everywhere. All the passwords and grips are but a quick google search away. Now think about this, if the passwords were of such great value to the secrecy of the fraternity, why haven't they ever been changed?! If masonry is legitimately trying to hold it's secrets, they do a pretty horrible job at it.

      So then what is going on here? I tell a new mason to not go online and look up everything while they're going through their journey (only a few months), not because I don't want them to know these things, but because there is an incredible value to going through the journey and feeling everything that goes on. It's beautiful, it's liturgy, it's symbolic, it speaks to the individual...right to their heart, where the true secrets are.

      See, the secrets are secrets because some are literally uncommunicable because there are no words to describe the feelings of the journey and pursuit of the Creator. The other aspect to the secrets are in respect to the concept of simply "finding the man of peace". Everybody's spiritual journey is unique and special to them, your path is not theirs and theirs is not yours. So it can be an offense to impose your journey onto them, it can actually cause more harm than good. Babies eat milk, men eat meat. You feed spiritual "meat" to a baby christian and it can do more harm than good.

      These concepts are very practical.

      The Kingdom of God has ALWAYS been concealed and always will be until the individual is ready to enter it. It's not concealed from people, it's concealed FOR them. You don't want people in the Kingdom that don't want to be there...frankly you CANT experience the Kingodm unless you do want to...Jesus specifically concealed the Kingdom of God, Paul openly talked about the "mysteries". The apostle Paul experienced the "3rd heaven" and "heard inexpressible things, things that no one is permitted to tell"

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    23. Jesus wasn't concerned about getting as many people to believe him as possible. He simply spoke of the Kingdom and fulfilled his mission. If people didn't believe him, he moved on.

      The bible, especially the NT, is very esoteric in my opinion. We're just innoculated to it. We've heard the story too many times and we think we know it. These are the same mysteries that's been handed down from generation to generation for those that are ready to wake up and receive it.

      Consider this...after the ressurection the disciples of Jesus never recognized him off immediately. He was always "disguised" as something else. He didn't look the same as when he was crucified. They recognized Him because they were intimate with his essence, his quality, and thats how we recognize Him still to this day.

      We meet him in the clouds because the clouds are the only thing that can make us "forget" there is a sun shining...when we are above the clouds we have unrestricted light, free from the shadows that cause confusion.

      Sorry...hahahahaha..got a little loose there at the end. I just get excited at the possibilities and the greatness of God in all of creation.

      But, that's some of what I would say about the secrecy of Masonry :-)

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    24. OK so...I think I'm 0 for 20 in my attempts to get a Mason to actually explain a reasonable, understandable purpose for Masonic secrecy. :)

      You are basically saying--"Sure we have secrecy but it's no big deal..people can look all this stuff up on the Internet". That's not an answer regarding the secrecy culture of Freemasonry, IMHO.

      Then the "esoteric" argument...made no sense to me whatsoever. First of all, there is NOTHING esoteric about the Bible or the Gospel. It is the exact opposite. Jesus was born in a barn next to a cow and a donkey in order to send the unmistakable message...that Christianity is for the lowly, the not-so-great, the not-so-grand. The message is wide open to all the world and thrives principally among the poor and downtrodden...not the upper echelon 'beautiful people'.

      People will many times fail to understand the truth of God's word, NOT because it is esoteric and has been concealed in exclusivistic fashion...but because people are spiritually dead and blinded. Their own sinful conditon is the cause.

      You keep wrenching things out of context from the Bible in order to 'prove' Christianity has a similar exclusivism to Freemasonry. The isolated incident with Paul....is isolated. There is no culture of exclusivism and secrecy in the Bible.

      You talk about the "sacredness" of Freemason doctrines. Good grief---human beings have no ability or authority to devise "sacred" doctrines. Freemason doctrines are not sacred...certainly not for any Bible believer. Only God's Word which came through divine inspiration can be said to be holy.

      In any case, your explanations about needing to conceal for the sake of protection..and 'casting pearls'...makes no sense. Protecting from whom...for what...and why exactly?? I'm detecting no sense in it. And Freemason doctrine has no "pearls" to begin with. The "pearls" of the Scripture are a reference to God's truth...not humanly devised Masonic doctrines.

      Again, by all rights, Freemasonry should have nothing to hide. And you're not providing any reasonable answer as to why they nevertheless have a secrecy culture.

      The reason I challenge Masons as to their secrecy is because I believe we can easily see the real reasons for the secrecy---for the purpose of nefarious activities on the part of upper echelon Masons who are engaging in all manner of wrongdoing...Toby Mac as one example. Popular "Christian" author/lecturer Kay Arthur as another example (read Chapter Two)...and I could go on and on with examples of underhandedness from secret and/or 'upper echelon' Masons...unknown to rank-and-file Masons.

      A couple other observations: You wrongly claim that Jesus isn't concerned about get many converts. Flat wrong. The Bible says "God is not willing that ANY should perish"..."for God so loves the whole world...that WHOSOEVER believes in Him shall..have everlasting life". Your attempts to claim "hey, the Bible is esoteric too" fail completely.

      The momentary failure to recognize Jesus after His resurrection...was momentary and was, again, an isolated incident which does not indicate an esoteric culture, nor a culture of secrecy. Please.

      Basically, you have argued--"Hey, Freemasonry has many important doctrinal secrets to keep." No, it does not. Certainly not from a biblical standpoint.

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  31. Black and white checkered shirt - Are you kidding me??? I own a shirt just like that. And if you ever go to any place at all, you will find that black and white checkers are a very common decorative element. Go to a freaking diner for God's sakes. 99% of the time the floor will look like that. Better not play chess or checkers either, because obviously if you do you will become a satanic spawn and be cast into hell.

    tobyMac Portable Sounds album cover - The picture is obviously not a pyramid, its a wireless/cell tower. Do a second of research for the love of god.

    Phallic tobymac poster - Yeah, I'm pretty sure every building looks like a phallic symbol to you.

    "emenating" rays - You obviously know NOTHING about graphic design, because this is an EXTREMELY, and I repeat EXTREMELY common design element.

    Arms that are bent like a masonic symbol - Yes Barnie. Arms bend like the masonic symbol. That's pretty much how arms are designed.

    Infinity symbol - Infiniti is a common mathematical symbol?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

    Please answer

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    1. Not sure what you're not understyanding about the simple fact that checkering is a well-known Masonic indicator. I never said every checkered shirt is satanic. A rather silly 'straw man' on your part, no?

      But yes, by deduction we can usually get a pretty solid idea as to when such checkering has Masonic significance...such as checkering on the floor at a Masonic lodge...or if Toby Mac is posing with a great big fat Masonic "Lion's Paw" salute, and is posing with a 'one-eye' presentation (for the hundredth time, by the way)....and has now placed a 5000 year-old all-seeing-eye satanic symbol smack on the cover of his latest CD.

      No dogmatism going on but...pretty common place, logical deduction. With the obvious Lion's Paw salute, I deduce that any other Masonic-like features are probably therefore intentional..the checkering, the eye thing, etc. And of course, for the Bible student...covert, coded, camouflaged signaling is almost certainly satanic.

      You're going to need to reconcile yourself to the biblical fact stated in point-blank fashion by the Lord Jesus Himself in the Olivet Discourse...

      ...that many satanic Christian leaders are emerging in these last days. These are people who are widely thought to be "Christian" but who are actually satanic behind the facade.

      If you don't like the evidence regardng Toby Mac...have you spotted a single one of these high level satanic "Christian" leaders? Name just one. Name one hugely popular Christian leader who is actually satanic...just as Jesus has said would be the case.

      If you study the Bible, particularly the Olivet Discourse, you will know that this platoon of satanic Christian leaders are used to lure the bulk of erstwhile Bible believers into an apostasy trap (which Jesus describes in great detail) who subsequently fall from the faith and split the gates of hell wide open.

      I'm just trying to give a heads-up.

      You're completely confused about the concept of modified occult symbolism. Look at the AOL corporate logo--it's a 'modified' eye/triangle satanic symbol.

      And no matter how many of these !!?? you type into your comments, the infinity symbol IS an occult symbol...along with, yes, being a mathematics symbol. Not sure how you think you can argue with simple, straight forward documented fact. By the way, are you saying Third Day is a group of mathematicians?

      The church world IS infiltrated with many, many wolves...just as is repeatedly warned of in the Bible and specifically warned of by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse. You act as though I'm completely off-base with this. No, it's actually BIBLE-based.

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    2. If tobyMac truly is satanic, what part of his music has satanic influence? In my opinion, it's not enough to just speculate about questionable symbols or whatnot, it is actually better to judge an artist by his music. tobyMac definately does not put out trashy music. His music is uplifting, encouraging, profanity and sex free.

      Yes I do believe there are wolves in the fold. I don't see why me defending tobyMac says anything about my other beliefs regarding wolves in the fold. I personally don't listen to a lot of CCM but not because I believe it is bad. I just don't find the music very interesting.

      Of course most symbols originate from satanic sources, but I don't find your logic surrounding the infinity symbol very convincing. It certainly doesn't prove that anybody is satanic especially since it's becoming a widespread symbol in society originating from the math sign.

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    3. My "logic" regarding the infinity symbol?? It IS an occult symbol. It is what it is. They use the symbol on satanic Tarot cards and all over the place. There isn't even denial from occultists. (?)

      If somebody inadvertently displays an occult symbol just once, accidentally...no, that doesn't mean they're satanic. Again, you're setting up a straw man. If there is SYSTEMATIC and repeated usage of symbols, then would I begin to theorize they may be deliberately engaging in occult practice. Don't know why it is so hard to follow such logic.

      Toby Mac has a gigantic load of occult symbols and signals sprinkled throughout his published materials.

      And...if you actually believe there ARE these spectacularly concealed "wolves" among the top Christian leaders (as Jesus has explicitly warned)...then please, point out even ONE of these.

      If you don't like my theories about Toby...point out even one popular top Christian leader on the scene today who has fooled 99% of the Christian community and who is actually satanic behind the facade.

      You ask what part of his music is satanic. ILL-M-I doesn't count? You have some sort of elaborate, arbitrarily contrived defense which breezily dismisses the lyrics in which he presents a triumphant "Illuminati comin thru" and portrays himself as part and parcel to it's globalist violence:

      "if I miss with my missles you're still gonna sizzle
      'Cause I frizzle fry radiation style worldwide"

      You recommend judging him by his music. OK...I went through the lyrics of every song on his new CD. Absolutely Gospel-less. There isn't a snowball's chance any soul on earth is going to find the salavation of the Lord Jesus from this CD.

      And Toby has HUGE difficulty with the word "Jesus". He...just...can't...bring himself to discuss Jesus directly. One song has one mention of "Jesus"...but the phrasing is indecipherable, meaningless.

      When he refers to "God" (and even that is rare)...FYI, satanists refer to "God" all the time, but they're referring to their dark lord, Lucifer. I'm not claiming that dogmatically regarding Toby Mac. I'm just saying---the guy displays innumerable (dozens) of satanic symbols...and his lyrics, not just on this latest CD...are absolutely useless for bringing people under the lordship and the salvation of Jesus.

      All due respect (and I appreciate your relative civility), it just seems to me some of you guys are setting the bar so high that...unless Toby were to perform a public satanic ritual, sacrificing a goat onstage during a concert (or whatever), you're not going to theorize he may be a wolf.

      If you don't understand how wolves (per the Bible's definitions) work, I wrote an article about the whole Apostasy Plot scenario in which I attempt an explanation. I would recommend reading that...then get back to me if still interested. You're thinking he has to include "sex" in his lyrics and perrformances in order to indicate occultism? Come on.

      Toby's job (if he is indeed a wolf) is to be a Pied Piper...to guide people into a trap when a certain specific scenario emerges...a scenario which has been precisely predicted by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24)...and described and seemingly boasted of by Toby in his ILL-M-I song.

      By the way, the article I referred to is linked at the top of this page...and is entitled "The Central and Critical Purpose For My Book "Wolves In Sheep's Clothing".

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    4. I don't have to tell you what christian leaders I believe have evil intentions, even though at least 4 come to mind immediately.

      I honestly can't believe you hold the opinion that tobyMac's newest CD is gospel-less.

      The song Steal My Show is about tobyMac wanting God to take over his life. The song does mention God a few times, as if it wasn't already implied.

      The song Forgiveness is ALL about how sweet it is when we find forgiveness through Jesus (and yes it says Jesus).

      The song Speak Life is about how optimism is the first step to being a light in the darkness. No, its not the only step obviously. What's wrong with a few optimistic songs?

      The song Lose Myself is clearly about giving your life to God, just like Steal My Show.

      In the song Family tobyMac talks about one of the core essentials of christianity, family.

      In the song Thankful for You tobymac is thanking God for always being there during his music career.

      Favorite Song is about how God is always on toby's (and jamie grace's) mind.

      Anything wrong with these songs? Please don't pull the "saying God doesn't mean anything because satanists call their dark lord Lucifer God" thing. First of all, a lot of satanists don't even BELIEVE satan exists. He's just their mascot for a way of living that promotes anarchy and evil. Second of all, I don't think you're going about this right. You might have found 2 things that were suspicious, and after that you find 100 things wrong, which are pretty normal but you might as well think they are true because of the first 2 things. Once again, please find 1 NEGATIVE effect his newest album might have on someone, even though you find it theologically shallow. What music do you listen to, by the way?

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    5. I don't know if I can help you. This guy has put a gigantic satanic symbol smack on the cover of his CD...and provided these utterly silly disingenuous excuses for it. He had previously put this same satanic symbol on a DC Talk CD cover and didn't provide ANY excuse in that case. This guy is saluting Satan in broad daylight, in front of millions of people...and you're excusing it. That's kind of the 'end of the story' right there. Like I said--I think the guy could sacrifice a goat right onstage and you'd come back with "yes but he mentioned 'God' in one of his songs".

      Interestingly, you've brushed aside my explanations about luciferians using the word "God"...and have forged bravely ahead with a rosy analysis of Toby's lyrics, based on the fact that he mentions "God".


      I have no idea what you're trying to argue when you say "lots of satanists don't believe satan exists". Huh?? Where did you get that information? Yes, there are many Luciferians who play an obnoxious shell game in supposedly making a distinction between Lucifer and Satan...and they'll grandiosely dismiss "Satan" as a Christian concoction.

      But there IS a "Satan" and there ARE real satanists/luciferians and they're aaaall over the world. And Toby Mac has signaled (inadvertently or otherwise) that he is one of them.

      He is doing things that create an evil appearance of pledging allegiance to Lucifer/Satan. At the very, very least there is the "appearance of evil".

      Ironically, you're all over MY case when I'm merely responding to this...with a common sense response.

      There should be NO alarm over his satanic symbol?? There should be NO concern? It's inappropriate to point out the satanic symbols and signals spread all over Mac's published materials? Over and over, posing for photos so that the 'single eye' is presented? The utterly blatant "Lion's Paw" masonic/satanic salute. On and on.

      Have you gotten all over Toby Mac's case about his gigantic, in-your-face satanic "Eye if Ra" symbol on the cover of his new CD? Just curious.

      And why wouldn't you name these infinitely dangerous "wolves" you say you are aware of?? You see a wolf among unknowing, unaware sheep...yet you're not going to point it out and you're going to leave these sheep in mortal and eternal danger?

      AND....and...you're going to come over here and bust MY chops because I'M trying to warn of some of these things?? Bro...I don't get it.

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    6. Yes, I must've had an incomplete song list. I see there are three additional songs on this CD that I hadn't seen. And yes, the one song mentions "Jesus" but I can't help noticing it was the other guy (Lecrae) who made the mention in HIS lyrics. Toby...just...can't...bring himself to mention "Jesus" other than on the absolute rarest of occasions. What is his record by the way? Something like 178 to 3--the numbers of song lyrics that do or don't include the actual word "Jesus"?

      As I've said elsewhere in this comment section--It's not absolutely vital to luciferians to not mention "Jesus". Satanists will preach the Gospel and tell people to pray to Jesus for salvation...all day long. Toby Mac however, in my view, seems to be one of these occultists who has prided himself in almost zero mention of "Jesus". There are some who do and some who don't..mention "Jesus", depending on their role in the apostatizing process.

      I would argue you are simply not understanding how a biblically-defined "wolf" works. These guys can stand on the stage and read Bible passages and tell people to pray to Jesus...as long as they see the grand and final Apostasy Plot rolling down the tracks towards implementation.

      You need to read the article I previously mentioned, to get an understanding.

      I would repeat--there is ZERO Gospel to be found on this CD. Yes, there is lots of 'insider lingo' in the lyrics. There is a kind of 'fill-in-the-blanks' aspect to these lyrics. The "already-churched" kids know how to "interpret" these persistently vague, fuzzy lyrics...the way someone would interpret a Rohrshach inkblot. But the 'outsider', the unchurched...they're going to get zip/zilch from 'insider lingo. I know...because I read all the lyrics. There is NO Gospel presentation.

      So I read the last three song lyrics this morning (which I had previously missed somehow) and I would certainly argue that this one single cryptic reference to "bleeding forgiveness", devoid of context, devoid of any other references to enable making some kind of connection...keeps this CD's "Gospel-less" status intact. Seriously--there isn't a snowball's chance anyone is going to come to a saving knowledge of the Lord Jesus.

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    7. Wait... you know that an outsider would be unable to interpret the lyrics... because you read the lyrics. Wow. That has to be one of the least intelligent things you've said this entire time. Dude, EVERYONE knows what Christianity is. Even if they don't know what's in the Bible, they know what we believe. You have no idea what an outside would feel about these songs, since you consider yourself to be an insider. Besides, you're making yourself sound arrogant, as though you alone know how to interpret lyrics.

      Let's discuss pagan/occult symbols for a moment, shall we? Firstly, the cross. That's a good place to start. The cross has been a pagan/occult symbol since it's creation in egypt, in the form of the ankh. Almost every western pagan culture has used the cross as a ritual symbol. So why are you all right with using the cross? It's occult, and therefore, by your logic, a sign of the illuminati - after all, it is everywhere/
      Next, how about the star of christmas or whatever the heck it's called? That symbol is also pagan/occult - it's very similar to designs used in geometric magic.
      The christmas tree is also pagan/occult. Druids and other pagan religions worship trees - where do you think the church got the christmas tree in the first place?
      The christian fish, which is EVERYWHERE these days, is a pagan/occult symbol from Babylon - it's a symbol of Dagon.
      And don't even try to say that it's different because these symbols are christian - they're pagan, and by your logic, occult. After all, pretty much every occult symbol used today is an integral part of almost every single freaking religion everywhere.
      My point being, pagan symbols are everywhere... deal with it. Pagan symbols have existed since cultures first began to develop, and they'll exist until the end of days.
      You're worried about TobyMac putting an eye on his album covers, or forming his hands in what you think is a satanic way (god forbid he steeple his hands - after all, that's satanic too). However, you're not worried that most if not all christian ritual symbols are pagan/occult in origin, and that they're used extensively throughout the christian world?

      A song doesn't have to be about the gospel to reach someone, or have spiritual worth. The gospel is the account of Jesus' life - mentioning the gospel story, or even mentioning Jesus' name, is not how you save someone. Telling the gospel story is not how you save someone.

      Also, since you're so enamored with the validity of google, why don't you google LaVeyan Satanists? They're the ones who believe in no deities at all, and merely serve the abstract idea of 'satan' (which, as I'm sure you know, since you are a bible scholar after all, is hebrew for 'adversary').

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    8. Furthermore, you worship on sunday. Let me make that clear - sunday. The day set aside to worship ra, mithros, helios, apollo, sol invictus, or any other sun god. The sun plays a huge part in occult rituals. But that's okay? Just as long as tobymac doesn't wear a checkered shirt and put his hand on his chest and *gasp* have one eye partially obscured by shadow??

      By your logic, all of your arguments about 'wolves in the fold' looking forward to the "Apostasy Plot" would mean that satanists (or 'luciferians', which may be one of the most inherently funny words ever) know when the end times will be, even though Christ himself said that no man would know the day of the coming of the Lord. Because, as you well know, the book of revelation makes it clear that the lord comes immediately after the "Apostasy Plot" begins.

      Let me make this abundantly clear - evil men cannot force God to return. None of their plots can cause Jesus to come out of the heavens. Jesus will return when paradise has been prepared for us, and when we (the children of Abraham) are ready, and not a moment soon or later.
      You looking furiously for signs of TEH ILLUMINATI won't help you at all. People have been trying to expose the masons and the illuminati and everyone else with 'deep dark secrets' for hundreds of years.

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    9. You say I "know" people won't receive the Gospel from Toby's lyrics? Uh yes...I do believe, in my opinion, people will not receive the Gospel from Toby's lyrics. We're BOTH delivering our views here in this discussion. For me to have an opinion...is "arrogant"?? I did not know that (as Johnny Carson used to say).

      And when YOU express an opinion, it is what? Divinely sanctified or something? We're both stating our views forcefully here. You need to calm down, maybe? I do not have divine inspiration but yes, I am conveying my views. In some cases, strongly-held views. So are you.

      And dude (I guess we're both presuming the other to be a rancher?), "everyone" does NOT know about salvation. People have been blinded. They have huge misconceptions. They have half truths and quarter truths and tenth truths. Your indirect assertion that Toby doesn't need to present the Gospel because everyone already has the truth and doesn't need to hear it anymore...wow, that's a jaw-dropper.

      It's right there in the Bible--the world is blinded to the truth and needs the supernatural intervention of God's Word empowered by the Holy Spirit.

      And another "wow"--your "discussion" of pagan symbols is way, way, way up the wrong tree. You've gotten the whole thing absolutely and perfectly...backwards. I do NOT back or endorse any "Christian" symbol anywhere on the face of the earth.

      I don't need or use any of these symbols you refer to. The "cross" symbol..."star" symbolism...the satanic yoni "fish" symbol. None of it. In my view, there are NO Bible-based, biblical Christians who endorse ANY symbols of ANY kind. The Bible prescribes ZERO symbols. Symbolism is the language of satanists.

      To whatever extent any symbolism has been injected into Christian culture, I would strongly suspect infiltrating wolf/occultists to be behind it. After all, the Bible explicitly and repeatedly warns of this infiltrating phenomenon...no matter how much sarcasm and sneering you deliver.

      And yes, many occult researchers would routinely point out that all these phallic "church steeples" have an obnoxious, pranksterish occult origin. The study of satanic symbolism incorporated into church architecture over the centuries...is a study unto itself. This is the Devil's world system, my friend (1John 5:19. You're going to see his marks of ownership all over the planet.

      By the way, the context of my comments here make it clear my references to the "Gospel" are not references to the entire 600 pages of accounts of Jesus' life on earth..as you so oddly try to misdirect. It is just a simple reference to the plan of salvation. I have simply been saying, there is no information in Mac's lyrics that would give anyone even the slightest idea about how to receive salvation and to accept Jesus as Lord and Savior.

      You strangely lecture me that "pagan symbols are everywhere...get used to it". OK. That's the entire theme of my 500 page e-book. Mama mia.

      1John 5:19 says all the world is temporarily held under the sway of the evil one. You think this is 'breaking news' for me?

      You refer to the "validity" of Google?? It's merely a search engine. (?) And...you think I haven't looked up LaVey in ten long years of researching satanism and satanic wolves...lol? I can certainly tell, you have only read the Reader's Digest version on LaVey. His son and numerous other eyewitnesses/survivors have long since come out with testimonies of LaVey's absolute hardcore satanic practitioning. Yes, I am well aware of the "Good Morning America with Ken and Barbie" version of Anton LaVey. His job was to be a distraction...a kind of public relations clown for his fellow satanists. Obviously, he succeeded in duping the general public.

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    10. Anyway...the LaVey scenario is neither here nor there as to the REALITY of a worldwide satanic movement, including an army of satanic wolves who have infiltrated the church, none of whom you can apparently identify.

      Interesting sarcasm regarding me being a "Bible scholar". There's an old rule of thumb out there that..."the individual who resorts to insult is sensing the weakness of his argument". Maybe that applies here?

      My so-called "argument" regarding (as you phrased it) "wolves in the fold looking forward to the Apostasy Plot"...is NOT an argument. It is a simple conveying of point-blank Scripture. Jesus stated directly (borrowing again from your phrasing) that "wolves in the fold are looking forward to the Apostasy Plot". Hello?

      You should step back and look at the illogic you are putting forward. You are claiming that Jesus' prediction about these wolves and their plot...creates a contradiction.

      Interestingly gratuitous sneering about the term "luciferian". A bit puzzling as to how you're deriving literal side-slapping humor. (?) That, along with the sarcastic, sneering reference to me as a "Bible scholar"...a developing pattern, perhaps?

      And you propose even more extreme illogic...in saying that satanists who are plotting an apostasy plot would therefore have to be credited with carefully conforming their plans to Scripture passages. Oy vey. What in the world?! Satanists care absolutely nothing about the prophecies of the Bible. No, they're simply doing their own thing...and God has perfectly predicted their actions.

      So therefore...your comments about "evil men cannot force the return of God", like so many of your other comments raises the question: Who in the world are you arguing with?? Who has said evil men are going to force God to return? Gooood grief, man.

      Your final statement which has almost a weird, disturbingly 'hopeful' aspect to it...that all my actions are futile...very, very strange stuff. Trying to point out these wolves is wrong? You didn't answer quite a few questions from my previous set of comments. I wouldn't want to either, if I were you. I already KNOW I'm not going to fill up arenas with people who want to listen to me. I'll leave the arenas to Toby.

      But you're dead wrong--I've been reaching people for ten years. I've had at least hundreds of folks thank me for opening their eyes to this deadly infiltration process which culminates in the apostasy plot which, according to you, was a huge mistake for Jesus to point out (??).

      By the way, the Bible does NOT "make it clear" that the Lord comes immediately "after the apostasy plot", in my understanding. According to the plain, simple words of Jesus in the Olivet Discourse, the apostasy plot COMMENCES the time of "great tribulation" which is followed by the rapture/"gathering of the elect".

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    11. Satanists care nothing about the biblical prophecies? What in god's name is wrong with you?? That's it - I'm done being nice. I tried to be patient. I really did.

      First off, answer my points when I make 'em. You still haven't responded about the Sunday thing. Secondly, the rapture is a false belief - show me the scripture that says that all good fundies like you will be spirited away to heaven.

      You're not even quoting me right! (Good trick, by the way. Did you go to law school? That's an obvious lawyer move. I'm impressed.) I said it was arrogant for you to assume that you knew that an outsider couldn't understand what tobymac was saying. Furthermore, if the world is blinded to the truth, and only God can reveal it, then why in His Holy Name are you making such a freaking stink about this? If only god can reveal the truth, then what you or i or president obama do matters about as much as a cockroach's fart in a hurricane.

      And what the heck do you mean I said jesus "revealing the apostasy plot" was a mistake? I'd really like to know when I said that. You show me where i said that in this debate, and I'll take it back. I expect a direct quotation, cause otherwise, you're a pathetic lying dog.

      Duping the general public... I'm both offended and infuriated. You can't really support your arguments, so you insult me and those who agree with me. "The individual who resorts to insult is sensing the weakness of his argument," indeed.
      And where did I say you'd never reached anyone? I never said that. Believe me, I'm all too aware of how many people you've 'convinced' - way more than I like.

      And as for the Gospel issue, THE ONLY FREAKING PEOPLE WHO WOULD LISTEN TO TOBY MAC ARE CHRISTIANS WHO'VE ALREADY BEEN TAUGHT ABOUT THE GOSPEL. The world hates christian music. So you'd think that since TEH DEVUL (who is obviously God's equal - why else would you be scared of the whiny little rat who has to ask God's permission for everything) supposedly is brainwashing everyone, he'd use something that would allure everyone.

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    12. And that's another thing - you act like the devil actually has power over us. Dude (and let's not be pathetic with the rancher cracks), if you supposedly believe that God controls everything, why does the Devil worry you? Fearing him that much is basically a form of worship - blaming everything bad that you do on the devil's satanic luciferian whisperings in your pure little ear is saying the devil has way more power than he actually does.

      The theme of your book is "there's pagan symbols everywhere - get used to it"? See, that's not the impression I got AT ALL. (Yeah, I read some of it - come at me, bro) The impression I got was that you were trying to spread fear by repeating every pathetic conspiracy theory about the new world order that's ever existed. But I'm not an internet blog author, so I guess I'm wrong. (Yes, that's sarcasm.)

      And dude, 'luciferian' is funny because it sounds like one of the horde of church denominations rampaging throughout the world. It's not even a real word. Furthermore, I'm 'sneering' (not sure how you can sneer through the computer, but whatevs, yo) at the way you keep saying that 'bible scholars see this' and 'only someone who's a true bible scholar could see this' yada yada so on and so forth etc. etc. It just sounds conceited.

      Besides, you don't need to worry about a worldwide satanist movement - after all, before long, most people will be atheist. Although that would be like armageddon for your church or whatever it is that you attend, wouldn't it?

      So let me get this straight - you're one of the only true christians, because you don't agree with normal christian symbols? Wow - and i thought i was being conceited.

      And I'm arguing with you, bubba. You freaking out like a spastic epileptic chihuahua because you think tobymac MIGHT be satanist is where I get the feeling that you're a little worried that the baddies might win. Look - they'll reach who they reach. You have no bearing on that. If they don't get them through Grand Wizard Tobius Macsus of the COntemporary Order, they'll get 'em elsewhere. Nothing - and I repeat, NOTHING you can do will stop that. The world is in God's hands, bro. Sit back, live your own life right, and watch as he takes care of his own business.

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    13. Not sure what your uproar is about regarding "satanists not caring about bible prophecy". I was simply saying--satanists don't care about prophecy IN THE SENSE THAT...they're not trying to conform their plans and conspiracies to fit Bible prophecy...which is what I understood you to be implying. Satanists are indeed VERY interested in the Bible.

      As to the misunderstanding about your "arrogance" charges..I was simply pointing out the illogical double standard of claiming my opinions require "arrogance" but your opinions do not. And your straw man in claiming I "assume" that I know something. I "assume" nothing. I simply have views and opinions which are just as subject to fallibility as anyone else's.

      Yes, I believe it is reasonable to say outsiders will not be able to derive a Gospel message from Mac's lyrics. It's a viewpoint. (?)

      As to your comments which I argued had the (inadvertent) net effect of saying Jesus made a mistake...first of all, maybe we could hope there may have been honest misunderstanding before we, as theoretical brothers, begin referring to each other as "dogs"?

      Secondly, I can quote you--

      "'wolves in the fold' looking forward to the "Apostasy Plot" would mean that satanists... know when the end times will be, even though Christ himself said that no man would know the day of the coming of the Lord."

      I'm not a rocket scientist but...you appear to be saying (and I quote) "wolves...looking forward to the apostasy plot [the very exact thing which Jesus teaches in the Olivet Discourse] would mean that satanists know when the end times will be".

      Whoops--Jesus shouldn't have presented the idea that "wolves are looking forward to [and preparing and conspiring towards] their apostasy plot". I could swear you just said it because, uh...I just quoted it. (?)

      Again though, there may be a mis-communication here somehow?

      My view that the public was "duped" regarding LaVey is "insulting"? For a guy who uses the Christianized version of the F-bomb thirty-eight times in four minutes...you certainly have a hair trigger for taking offense and perceiving "insult". Yes, I believe you are wrong about LaVey and that the mainstream media has given out false, incomplete information about the guy. I've read the heart-breaking testimony of his son and other of his victims. Disagreeing with you is not an "offense". Good grief.

      I heartily agree with you...that Toby is only targeting the 'already-churched' crowd. I have said that previously, numerous times (elsewhere). That is exactly my point. My theory is that the purpose of Pied Pipers in the CCM world...is to cordon off the sheep and prepare them for the apostasy plot warned of in the Olivet Discourse.

      As you admit, CCM is a very in-grown world. An 'insider' world. For Christianized people only. You ask why the Devil isn't doing a better job of "luring" non-Christians into CCM for the purpose of "brainwashing", according to my 'dark theories' about CCM. Why bother to brainwash people who are ALREADY brainwashed?? Yes, I have some dark theories about CCM but...the lost are ALREADY headed for Hell. The mission is accomplished.

      You say I'm "worried that the baddies might win". I'm prayerfully concerned as opposed to "worried" or anxious. "Be anxious for nothing..." after all. Yes, I am concerned and am attempting to alert folks.

      I'm dumbfounded when you say "they'll reach who they reach" and "nothing you can do will stop them". Unbelievable coming from...a Bible believer, is it? Had you read the Scriptures about our role in saving the lost? I've won numerous people away from the kingdom of darkness. You even agreed with me. Now you're saying, the child of God has zero impact on anything. As far from the truth as you can get.

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    14. Michael: "Dude (and let's not be pathetic with the rancher cracks)..."

      OK, then how about referring to me politely..instead of in the manner of a thirteen-year old with a skateboard? Routine politeness is too much to ask? Between Christians?

      Your 'fearing the Devil" comments are a strawman but...knock yourself out. Any time anyone proposes resisting evil...this means they're fearful and quasi-worshipful of the Devil?? Alrighty then. Yes, I'm pointing out satanic symbolism in CCM and passing along Jesus' warnings in the Olivet Discourse. How terribly unbiblical of me!

      You say the whole world is going to become atheist? Uh, nooo..all the people of the world are going to become satanists when the Antichrist explodes onto the world scene...and the Bible describes how the whole world immediately follows after him and is required to worship him.

      Frankly, your comments seem to be disintegrating into aimless, pointless ranting...sarcastic swipes. This thing about atheism...I mean, it's borderline irrational, in terms of commonly known biblical truth.

      You say I must think I'm one of the only true Christians because of my position that the Bible prescribes zero symbolism? Seriously...what a ridiculous, obnoxious question. Yes, I have a view that there is ZERO biblical symbolism...that the Bible prescribes ZERO symbolism and that any foray into symbolism on the part of Christian people is risky at best...given what I think I have discovered about occult symbolism over the last ten years. Just my view. No, I do not believe I am one of the only true believers. YOU, my friend, are the one with the MASSIVE dogmatism. Food for thought, no?

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    15. You really love exaggerations, don't you?

      Look, dude, I'm not being impolite by calling you dude. Informal? Yes. Very much so. But it's hardly impolite- no more impolite than calling you "brother" or "man" or "pal". Besides, considering that I used to BE a skater, it should make sense that that's how I'm gonna talk. Sorry, but you'll have to get over it.

      Now, on to the matter at hand. Firstly, atheism. The Bible never says that people will become satanists. It says that they'll fall under the sway of the Beast - which could either be a man, or a nation, or a group of leaders. That can be achieved through atheism, too. And given the rate of growth of agnosticism and atheism, I think atheism is way more of a threat to the church than satanism. After all, even the most spiritually dead people know that satan is the enemy, and that only wackos worship him.

      Furthermore, regarding this 'apostasy plot', I've read the olivet discourse. Many times. I know what it says. I still say you're wrong, and that you're misquoting me. But maybe you're right. Maybe there was a misunderstanding.
      Moreover, I never said you were a lying dog. I said you would be a lying dog if you didn't show me exactly where I said that jesus revealing his prophecy was a mistake.

      Furthermore, the bible does contain some approved symbolism - I bring to the table the ark of the covenant, the stone tablets, that golden snake thingy moses used to cure the israelites, and the dove that descended from heaven during jesus' baptism.

      You know as well as I do that I never said we shouldn't resist evil. I firmly believe we should. I said that FEARING satan is basically worshipping him. Satan is not something to fear - he's under God's thumb. He can't touch you unless God wills it. That is my point about not trying to destroy evil. You can't. Only God can.

      And don't be foolish - of course we're to spread the message. But once we've spread it, we need to drop it and let God work on people. None of the disciples hammered on people to believe Jesus was the Messiah. Jesus didn't force people to believe in him. He spoke his words, and God did the rest. You want to know how to draw people in? Ignore their faults. Treat them like people, instead of infidels or unbelievers. That's what we're commanded to do - we're not commanded to force our religion down people's throats.

      And in regards to Toby Mac, show me two actual, valid ways - just two - that Toby Mac has lured someone away from Jesus into following Satan, and I will take back everything I said defending him. And I mean, valid. I don't mean tell me again that he doesn't talk about the gospel at all, or something like that.
      Also, on that note, please stop bringing up the whole goat-sacrifice thing. It doesn't even make sense - the israelites sacrificed goats, too. Satanists aren't the only ones who utilize animal sacrifice.

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    16. And you are well aware why I was insulted by your comment, dude - when you say, "obviously, he succeeded in duping the general public" in DIRECT reply to the statement I made concerning LaVeyan satanism, that is clearly a poorly-concealed insult about my naivety. That said, I probably shouldn't have gotten so angry about it. I apologize for my anger.

      We can't save the lost if they're blind. Trust me, I've tried - some very close family members of mine are what I would consider lost. That said, I'm not going to keep trying to force them to see the light, like you've done in a somewhat kinder way with your... I'm not going to say followers, because that makes it sound like you have a cult... let's just say, with those you've 'saved'. Those family members of mine just won't listen - God is the only one who can reach them.
      Listen, dude, believe it or not, I really do have a lot of respect for you and your beliefs. I disagree with what you're saying, and I'll try for a while to convince you that I'm right, but I'm not trying to be disrespectful of what you believe.
      That said, I don't think you've really "saved people from darkness". I think you may have just struck a chord with people who believe like you do, and who were looking for a second witness. I think you gently indoctrinated some people. But I don't think you really saved anyone - that is arrogance, whether you meant it that way or not. However, I will maintain the possibility that I am 100% wrong, and that you are actually doing the Lord's work.

      And I am a bible believer, yes. I read the bible literally, which is why I don't believe in the antichrist, or the rapture, or a grand satanist plot. Apostasy doesn't have to mean converting to satanism, or even incorporating satanic rituals into Christianity.
      What I do believe is that satan's work is done for now, and we're making a much bigger mess of things than satan ever could. I do believe that there's more important things to do than worry about the future. I believe that you (not you, personally) can't force someone to believe like you, because it's meaningless.

      (By the way, on a completely separate note, what denomination - if any - do you belong to? I'm curious.)

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    17. You: "Yes, I have a view that there is ZERO biblical symbolism...that the Bible prescribes ZERO symbolism and that any foray into symbolism on the part of Christian people is risky at best...given what I think I have discovered about occult symbolism over the last ten years." "I don't need or use any of these symbols you refer to. The "cross" symbol..."star" symbolism...the satanic yoni "fish" symbol. None of it. In my view, there are NO Bible-based, biblical Christians who endorse ANY symbols of ANY kind. The Bible prescribes ZERO symbols. Symbolism is the language of satanists."

      You believe the bible has ZERO symbolism? Wow. You completely just lost any respect I had for your biblical knowledge. The bible itself (the old testament anyway) was written in paleo-hebrew, a picture language similar to the Egyptian way of writing. In fact, YHWH wrote the ten commandments in this symbol language with his own freaking finger.

      "Yes, I must've had an incomplete song list. I see there are three additional songs on this CD that I hadn't seen. And yes, the one song mentions "Jesus" but I can't help noticing it was the other guy (Lecrae) who made the mention in HIS lyrics. Toby...just...can't...bring himself to mention "Jesus" other than on the absolute rarest of occasions. What is his record by the way? Something like 178 to 3--the numbers of song lyrics that do or don't include the actual word "Jesus"? "

      Dude....good lord. You publish an internet article claiming tobymac is a satanic wolf who never mentions God in his songs and you didn't even read all the lyrics of his songs? Sounds like someone needs to do a second of research. And tobyMac can't bring himself to mention Jesus? Have you ever heard of "Jesus Freak?"

      "I'm dumbfounded when you say "they'll reach who they reach" and "nothing you can do will stop them". Unbelievable coming from...a Bible believer, is it? Had you read the Scriptures about our role in saving the lost? I've won numerous people away from the kingdom of darkness. You even agreed with me. Now you're saying, the child of God has zero impact on anything. As far from the truth as you can get."

      That's not at all what Michael said. First of all, I find it very self righteous of you to be boasting about how many people you have "saved." Tell me, were these people Christians before or not? I find it hard to believe anyone but a christian or an atheist looking for hilarious material would stumble across this website.

      Second of all, Michael was not discouraging evangelism. He was simply bringing up a fairly common Jewish belief - that there will always be wolves and there will always be people who don't give in to the wolves.

      "Interestingly, you've brushed aside my explanations about luciferians using the word "God"...and have forged bravely ahead with a rosy analysis of Toby's lyrics, based on the fact that he mentions "God". "

      It was you, sir, that said toby rarely mentions God. It is YOU, sir who was proven wrong about toby's mentions of God and who is pulling up the "which God?" excuse. Not sure I can prove anything to you if you don't play by your own rules.

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    18. To "Michael"--

      A willingness to call someone a "lying dog" is completely unacceptable between Christians. And I never SAID you "said" I was a lying dog. That's a twist. I simply asked if there might not be an alternative approach.

      You referred to me as a psychotic "chihuahua"...so there's that. Your denial about the abrasiveness of the term "dude" when used during a pointed debate is quite dubious. Between Christians, if a guy says "hey, I'm not happy with you calling these names" and you respond with "dude, dude, dude" such as you did...where's the charitable Christianity in that? I'm asking you to stop calling me names.

      Your ideas about worldwide atheism...don't know of anyone who holds such a view. The Scriptures are clear about a worldwide satanic "worship" movement in the end times.

      Rev. 13:15,16 -- "...all who refused to WORSHIP the image to be killed. It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads..."

      Atheists don't "worship". The Book of Revelation directly contradicts your idea of worldwide atheism.

      You say I'm "wrong" about the Olivet Discourse. Wrong where? I've done not much more than simply quote the passage. Satanic Christian leaders come forth to lure Christ-followers into a trap. Jesus says to be on the look-out for these satanic wolves. What's to debate?

      Who are YOU warning regarding these emerging satanic "false prophets"...and who ARE some of these satanists...if I am supposedly so far off in my concerns about CCM artists who have ten-foot tall satanic symbols on their CD covers??

      You admonish me--"don't be foolish". It wasn't MY foolishness. I was quoting your comments about the uselessness of trying save folks from the Devil. NOW you've reversed your position. I have no idea what is going on with the reversible positions.

      You say "once we spread it, we drop it". What in the world does that mean? It's meaningless. I spread the Gospel virtually every day of my life. Why would I "drop it"? I will continue to warn people about someone like Toby Mac (I've got a tentative Part 3 and Part 4 coming out) with his obstinate willingness to perpetrate "appearances of evil". Toby isn't quitting. Why should I quit??

      You talk about the Bible's alleged "approved symbolism"? The ark was an actual ark, an actual object...not a symbol. The snake statuette was an actual statuette. It was never proposed as a symbol for God's followers. It was used for a brief time, then presumably thrown in a dumpster. The "dove" of Luke 3:22 was never presented as a "symbol".

      By the way, if I am aware these other symbols you previously mentioned are occult/pagan based (as you obviously agree)...why would you accuse me of spiritual arrogance...only because I reasonably and understandably have an aversion to the idea of pagan symbols being used to supposedly represent Christianity?? First, you notified me I was in error if I SUPPORT pagan Christian symbolism (which it turned out, I didn't) and if I REJECT pagan symbolism, I am supposedly STILL error. Are you coming or going?

      I have no denomination. Technically, I could be called fundamentalist...as I hold to the historical "five fundamentals of the faith". But I have hung out in many of the typically 'hip' Evangelical churches and attend such a church now. I am emphatically non-Charismatic and hold to a simple, straight-forward interp of the Olivet Discourse in which Jesus plainly describes a rapture/"gathering of the elect" which occurs "after the great tribulation"
      (Matthew 24:29,31)...FYI.

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    19. To Michael again--

      Once again you're asking me for evidence of Toby's satanic allegiances.

      I've already attempted to explain to you how I think this "false prophet"/"satanic Christian leader" scenario works with regard to Toby Mac, if we're to theorize he may be a part of that. Again, you seem to be demanding a simplistic answer...as though I need to be able to point to something blatantly satanic that he is doing.

      You'll have to forgive me but that's an amazing request to someone like myself,...given Toby's fifteen foot satanic symbol plastered on all 10 million of his CDs in Walmarts throughout the land.

      According to Jesus in the Olivet Discourse...the goal of a satanic wolf is to develop a huge credibility over time so that when moment arrives to literally direct church-goers to "desert places"...to literally climb onto the FEMA trains to be taken to the FEMA death camps (er, "relocation camps") these wolves will have that much credibility.

      People ask me how and why such an unusual scenario might develop. It seems plain to me, given Jesus' comments in the Olivet Discourse...this "emergency" occurs at the time of the (so-called in the Discourse) "abomination of desolation".

      This is almost universally understood to be the explosive emergence of the Antichrist (in the "holy place" in Jerusalem) and what many now equate with the coming "New World Order".

      Millions of PreTribbers will be panic-stricken as they had assumed they would be "raptured" by now. The world will be ready to turn on all these hesitating church-goers who are balking at signing up for the New World Order and the mark of the beast...because, as the Rev.13:3 indicates, "all the world was amazed and immediately followed after the beast". Christian hold-outs will come under extreme contempt and hatred from the world.

      The satanic wolves/false-prophets (would this include Michael Smith, Toby Mac, Pat Robertson, Rick Warren and hundreds of others?) will step forward with a false offer of safety at "desert locations" exactly the description of all these hundreds of so-called "FEMA relocation camps".

      The job of these 'false prophets" currently, IMO...is to cordon off the "sheeple". Create a comfy "happy bubble"...keep folks hypnotized and sedated in a cozy ingrown, insider, exclusivistic "Christianized" context...nice and sleepy and completely unprepared and unwarned regarding the tsunami shockwave of the Antichrist's explosive emergence on the world scene.

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    20. To "Anonymous" September 4, 2012 3:20 PM

      Somehow you're badly mixing the issues. I'm not sure if you know what you're talking about but...Hebrew letters are still just that....letters. Regardless of whether they have a 'symbol' origin, they've now been converted into letters for use in the Hebrew alphabet.

      In the case of the Hebrew language, the Bible is NOT presribing or endorsing the use of any symbolism. It is simply utilizing the Hebrew alphabet which (assuming your correct) was derived out of various symbols. The "symbols" are no longer being presented as symbols. They're being presented and utilized as letters. Good grief--how have you mixed this up?

      I also don't understand the level of consternation. Oy vey. This other guy was trying to foist satanic symbols on Christianity. Maybe you should get consternated with him!

      And oh my...again, your near heart attack over my discovery of the three other songs. It took a mere 24 hours to correct. The Toby Mac people had put out a tentative song list to which they later added the three songs. Over night, the extra songs were discovered, problem solved. Talk about desperately reaching to manufacture a scandal. Ridiculous.

      And you say you find me "very self-righteous"? Oh, brother.

      That's quite the 'ability' you have --reading into someone's heart and mind. I'm merely reporting there seem to be numbers of people who have credited my Internet ministry for helping them unravel and thus dodge the deadly deceptions of these last days which, according to Jesus, are going to lure the majority of conservative Bible church attenders straight through the gates of Hell.

      I can't testify about the progress of my ministry...apart from 'spiritual pride'?? A ministry which I repeatedly and often refer to as..."tiny", "teensy", "pip-squeak", etc. You've never heard of a Christian ministry which routinely attempts to chart and report it's progress? I am unable to keep up with your conspiracy theories.

      And again, the utterly strange, unprovoked seething and antagonism...what IS your problem, my friend? You have quite the hair trigger for passing judgment on someone, no?

      Lastly, with your comments about the mention of "God"...you oddly contradict yourself by first reporting (accurately) my statement that Toby "RARELY" mentions God...then claiming that ANY mention of God disproves my claim that he RARELY mentions of God. What in the world?

      Delete
    21. Obviously you have no idea what I mean by "paleo-hebrew". In ancient times an alphabet made up of symbols is much more than just symbols-converted-to-letters. The symbols REPRESENTED OBJECTS. For example, the letter yohd represented a clenched fist. The letter tahv represented a door. For someone so staunchly against symbolism of any kind, I find your acceptance of alphabet symbols interesting.

      You're accusing ME of desperately reaching to manufacture a scandel? I couldn't of described you better. Staring at a Michael W. Smith album cover for an hour searching for ANY symbol whatsoever or rooting through corporate logos which could resemble an eye AT ALL is called desperately reaching to manufacture a scandel. And on your point, I have had the official list for tobymac's album for a long time. This seems to be a lack of research on your part, especially since you should be an expert on tobymac if you are going to be claiming he's a satanic wolf.

      No no no, you misunderstood what I said regarding t-mac's mentions of God in his songs. Here's what happened-

      You said tobymac rarely mentions God and never, ever goes anywhere near the gospel.

      I replied with a list of his songs just from his new album that talk about God and salvation (the gospel).

      You claim that tobymac might be referring to "lucifer" when he says god, thus rendering my argument moot.

      That isn't fair.

      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

      I want to read your reply but this will probably be my last comment. A word of advice from me tho is -You aren't really going to reach the lost with your message. Symbolism is a small, tiny speck of dust in the grand scheme of things and if I were you I wouldn't waste my life over it.

      God Bless.

      ~Anonymous

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    22. I agree with Anonymous. I have nothing to gain from this conversation, since you refuse to use logic or listen to my arguments, and have repeated all of your arguments many times over. I'm done.

      I sincerely hope you are actually doing God's work in all of this, or at least that making these accusations and conspiratorial statements gives you peace in some way.

      For what it's worth, I've actually enjoyed our debate. It's been interesting, and you remain one of the few people I've argued with who hasn't resorted to swearing to make points. That's a little refreshing.

      In any case, I wish you the best.

      God bless you and your family, sir.
      -Michael-

      P.S. You're probably right - it probably was rude of me to continue calling you dude even after you expressed distaste at the word. I apologize if I offended you.

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    23. To "Anonymous" of September 4, 2012 7:05 PM

      Your arguments haven't touched my arguments. It doesn't MATTER if these were previously "symbols". They're now being used as letters. I don't even know what you're arguing about anyway.

      I repeat my original assertion -- the Bible prescribes no symbolism. That statement doesn't even TOUCH on the issue of Hebrew letters having originated from symbols. I have no clue what you're having a fit over. I was trying to defend against the idea that genuine Christians have adopted all manner of satanic/pagan symbolism. Why aren't you defending me?? Why aren't you siding with me?? Your Hebrew alphabet issue has absolutely zilch to do with the topic at hand. Goood grief!

      And yes you ARE "desperately manufacturing" controversy. It is absolutely the silliest thing ever. A tiny momentary misunderstanding..solved literally overnight. I clicked on the wrong link. Your 'indignant', judgmental harrumphing is nothing short of bizarre.

      And your ridiculing, broadbrushing remarks about Michael Smith's satanic symbolism. Was there an actual argument in there? Or were you merely making a bee-line for insult and ridicule, o Christian brother?

      God forbid you have any disagreements with a brother at your church in the foyer after a Sunday service. I hope you at least take it out to the parking lot.

      You say it's "not fair" for me to point out how luciferians are referring to their dark lord Lucifer when they use the word "God". I......don't get it. it's not "fair"? OK but...luciferians DO refer to Lucifer as "God". Don't know what else to tell you.

      Boy, wouldn't it be nice if someday Toby would come out with some lyrics that were equivalent to "I uphold Jesus as my Lord and my Savior...the King of Kings, Lord of Lords. He has brought Lucifer down to defeat. He will send Lucifer to a fiery judgment, just as he deserves." Something like that.

      Even if we had to compile such expressions from a wide assortment of Toby's song lyrics...that would still be fine by me. Unfortunately...he's never made anything within a million miles of such definitive statements of allegiance.

      Delete
  32. Uh, I kinda agree with Anonymous Bro right above me ^^^ - the rage guy.

    Most of this is kinda obviously just looking for problems - which I believe is kinda spoken of badly in the Bible. Of course, I'm no bible scholar.

    Besides, everyone (and i mean EVERYONE) does the hiding the one eye thing ALL THE TIME. If the only people who do that are Illuminati pawns, that means we're all kinda hosed, brosefs.

    Also, ''illuminati'' just means "enlightened" - the same way masons are people who work with stone. They're just words that have been adopted by organizations. Big whoop.

    Rly, I think this is just yet another attempt at being spiritually discerning without actually possessing spiritual discernment.

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    1. No, it isn't "everyone and I mean every one" who is flashing the single eye thingy. But there are a LOT of folks doing it. And it IS an occult indicator. The world system is predominated by the "spirit of this world", i.e. the Devil. So you ARE going to see indications of allegiance to him. He has his followers.

      You realy need to read up a bit more...when you claim the term "Illuminati" (with capital "I") merely has a direct literal meaning of "enlightenment". Come on now.

      According to Scripture, the Devil is taking over the world, however briefly he may achieve this. He has an organized Antichrist cabal that is bringing this about...whether we refer to them as a "cabal...a "satanic crime syndicate"..."the Illuminati"...whatever.

      Jesus (in Matt.24) describes how part of this cabal, the satanic "Christian" division, are going to execute a very carefully planned "apostasy plot"...designed to cause the majority of conservative church-goers to fall away into apostasy and eternal doom. Some of you folks need to wake up and smell the coffee. The world of CCM (contemporary Christian music) is not a big Disneyland. It is one of Satan's prime trargets. How could any Bible student fail to realize that? How could believers fail to have at least the basic intuitive realization--"Hey, there MUST be some bad guys in CCM" ??

      But nope, all these hundreds of thousands of Christian young people partying on like all the world is nothing but a great big "happy happy bubble". A huge tragedy in the making...just as Jesus has explicitly forewarned.

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    2. Illuminati - latin, lit. 'enlightened'

      And no, scripture does not say that the Devil is taking over the world. It says that he's the prince of the earth - as in, he's ruled the earth for a lot longer than we been alive, bro.

      I think you need to read MAtt. 24 a little more carefully. It says that false prophets will lead people away - false prophets, by biblical definition in the old (and new) testaments, are men and women who encourage people to rebel against god, and forsake his teachings, and who prophesy things that don't come to pass. As of right now, I can't think of any contemporary christian artists who are doing any of those things.

      However, I can think of people (namely, yourself) who are falsely accusing christian artists of satanic allegiance. False accusations are an abomination, as I recall - something in the ten commandments about not bearing false witness against thy neighbor or something like that. In my book, accusing someone falsely of having satanic allegiances is a cruel and petty attempt to feel better about your own weak walk with God.
      We all have satanic allegiances, bro. Every time you break God's laws, you're waving the satanic flag.

      Incidentally, I'm curious as to why you never use Old Testament verses to make points. You only use the New Testament. It's intriguing.

      Delete
    3. Ok, I'm a little confused as to who is who here. Did you step into the other discussion, or something? No problem...I was just assuming your comments there were his 'response' comments.

      Anyway...were you the one making the argument about "worship on Sunday"? Hopefully, I "worship" all seven days of the week. There IS no "day" of worship. Anyone can "worship" any day they want. Many churches have meetings 4 or 5 days of the week. The early church met on Sundays because that was the day many people were already observing religious (pagan, as you say) practices.

      I'm not sure what you think your argument is here. Pagans have no power nor authority to declare Sunday as a "pagan" day. All 7 days of the week are assigned by the Lord God.

      You are incorrect about the word "Illuminati". First of all, you have capitalized it. Therefore it is a noun...not a verb or adverb. Secondly, the capitalization would indicate it refers to a specific, identifiable group...as opposed to mere random "illuminated ones".

      Thirdly, the word is in the plural form. "Illuminati" refers to two or more members of this specific group.

      When Toby Mac refers to the "Illuminati"...that is a specific, identifiable group. Many, many ex-satanists routinely testify to the "Illuminati" being alive and well...and by their descriptions, this group perfectly fits the biblical descriptions of the Antichrist cabal.

      When Toby uses the capitalized word "Illuminati", your arguments about this being simply a generic reference to "enlightenment"...come on. Toby even goes on to describe the details of the Antichrist cabal's (the Illuminati's) geopolitical aggressions.

      You say the Devil is "the prince of the earth"? Actually, it says he is the "prince and power of the air".

      I'm not sure what you're not understanding about basic Bible teachings but...yes, the whole world is under satanic domination. And yet, at the same time, there is a very specific satanic geopolitical religious movement ongoing.

      A world domination process which results (however briefly) in the whole world worshipping at Lucifer's and his Antichrist's feet. The Devil has not yet achieved that. This is his supreme goal.

      You say you don't spot any false-prophet/wolves on the scene today. I thought you said you knew about four of them?

      In any case, your assertion is flabbergasting. You literally know of not a single "Christian" leader who is mis-teaching and mis-guiding people towards apostasy and thus, doom?

      If you can't spot any wolves in CCM and elswhere sprinkled throughout the flock...it's because your observation powers are off. The Bible flatly declares the reality of "wolves in sheep's clothing" as an ongoing phenomenon throughout the centuries of the church. Spectacularly deceptive, ingeniously disguised satanists who have infiltrated the flock.

      You're trying to set up a quite silly, sawed-off scenario...where any "false prophets" are required to teach blatantly satanic doctrines (such as sacrificing goats, or something?) in order for us to say "oh, there's a false prophet". I don't think even you believe your own nonsense, to be quite frank.

      These false prophets are spectacularly deceptive, in as much as it is clear from the Olivet Discourse text that the huge and vast majority of Bible-believers are fooled into thinking these are genuine Christians.

      They are not going to get up there and say (as you are pretty much ridiculously suggesting: "Worship Satan! Hail Satan!"

      Jesus indicates their deceptiveness is so skilled that they are able to lure the majority of church-goers out to "desert places" and "inner rooms".

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    4. Millions of conservative Christians (erstwhile Bible believers) who expected to be "raptured before all the bad stuff happens" will be in a state of utter panic and these satanic "Christian" leaders step in with false comfort and deadly directions to this pre-arranged apostasy trap, set up in remote locations. Once in isolation, the boom will be lowered--"Join the New World Order, take the mark of the beast...or go to the deepest dungeons."

      Jesus foretells that the majority will capitulate and split the gates of Hell wide open.

      Your accusation that I am flatly "accusing" people of being satanists is, itself, a lie. And now YOU have become the false accuser. Throughout ALL of my comments I am always careful to measure my words. By the time one gets through reading my comments about Toby Mac...yes, admittedly, it does NOT look good for Toby.

      But I am simply saying--Toby Mac has displayed numerous satanic symbols. He gives an "appearance" (intentionally or not) of being satanic. I cannot make a dogmatic conclusion. And I have been careful to qualify in that manner, over and over...despite your dishonest and false accusation to the contrary.

      But if he has the audacity and the willingness to blatantly disobey the Scripture's advisories regarding "appearance of evil"...then I won't hesitate to point it out.

      He is most definitely on a "suspect" list. I most definitely hold his lyrics in extremely low esteem in terms of presenting any Gospel truth. But I draw up short of dogmatic conclusions, as you well know from reading almost any portion of my comments on Toby Mac.

      If he is flashing 5000-year old satanic symbolism on his CDs, he should EXPECT controversy and controversial discussions. But people who express grave concerns about his possible satanic allegiances are not flat declaring him to be satanic..they're merely "expressing grave concerns" (to quote myself).

      With regard to your OT/NT questions, I'm not sure what exact conspiracy theory you're cooking up here. (?) I rely extensively on the OT. OT passages play a huge role in Ch. 17 of my e-book (linked above), as one tiny example.

      Delete
  33. Thank you so much for publishing this! I've just found your site, and am reading through the material. I have to share, though, right now, as I'm a little freaked out by Toby Mac.

    It started when we went to one of his small church "concerts" earlier this year. He runs some videos while his group performs, and they are projected up onto a screen behind them. The material that is in these videos is very strange. It's not uplifting, or positive, but involves a lot of abstract objects, dark, shadowy trees, sad people. Nothing that you would expect at a Christian concert.

    I've started to study the "illuminati," and I think that a lot of artists are not aware of what their marketing people are doing around them. They take their word for "what sells," I'm guessing. And that's what I thought the explanation was for Toby Mac's weird visuals. There are things in abstract materials, oftentimes, that are designed to convey a subliminal message. If you are not aware that these things happen, it's easier to fall prey to them.

    At the same time, Toby's music *seems* to be Christian. If I was the devil, I wouldn't want that music to get out as much as Mr. Mac's does. But I'll have to listen a little more carefully, perhaps. I hope he is not dabbling in the dark side.

    Now my husband has bought Toby's latest album. It's called "Eye On It," and has one big eye on the front. This is a popular illuminuttie symbol, and I was very disappointed when I saw that. But I'm looking forward to reading the rest of your material, and finding out more about what the story is here. God wills that none should be lost, which means that none WILL be lost. We need to pray for Toby, and Jay-Z, and Madonna, and all the other nutty minions that are falling hook, line, and sinker for the promises of those that may have gone way astray. God bless you and yours, and keep up the good work!

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    1. Thanks for the kind words. I'd say--keep on reading and studying. There are many wolves among the sheep these days.

      I'd make the argument that Toby mMc's lyrics are utterly useless in terms of presenting the Gospel. There is NO Gospel presentation...no mention of Jesus that I could find...nothing. Food for thought for the hubby!

      Thanks again.

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    2. Certainly no good lyrics in "Ill-M-i" - quite the opposite! And even if Toby didn't write those, he sings them. I'll check out the other ones soon. God bless - you are a most courageous soul!

      Delete
  34. Wow... If you act this way about TobyMac and third day, I'd hate to hear what you thought about bands like Hawk Nelson and MXPX or christian metal bands like Theocracy.

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    1. On first glance, I don't see much in the way of troubling symbolism. Although...Theocracy has a CD cover in which a 'crown of thorns' is encircling the "O" in "Theocracy" in such a way that one could certainly theorize it was postioned that way to create an "eye". Dunno.

      The problem is...even with bands that aren't covertly occultist, I get the distinct impression from reading their utterly vacuous song lyrics (apologies to anyone offended by my candor)...that most of these young guys are virtually illiterate in terms of deeply thought-through Bible theology...and much, much more so, 'end times' Bible prophecy.

      When the Antichrist explodes onto the world scene (which seems about to happen--sooner rather than later)...I think most or nearly all the top level Christian bands will be easily manipulated into participating in the "apostasy plot" operations.

      They'll think they're "helping" by encouraging panic-stricken church people to head for "safety" out to these "desert places" Jesus warns of. Most likely, these are the already set-up "FEMA relocation camps".

      Any widely known and/or popular Christian leaders (such as members of the three bands you mentioned) will be approached to aid in this manner...and unless they have solid discernment and see through this deception plot, they'll probably agree to offer their assistance.

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    2. You think bands like Theocracy have vacuous lyrics and are spiritually illiterate? I think you should listen to a few of the songs on As The World Bleeds. It might just change your mind. That, or make you head explode.

      And I really can't wrap my mind around why someone would stare at album covers to try to find eyes. But whatever floats your boat, I guess - I'm not here to judge.

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    3. You just invited me to comment on a few of your favorite bands and now you're smacking me for spending the two minutes to do so...lol??

      I don't know about Theocracy specifically but yes...a HUGE percentage of these bands have utterly useless, Gospel-less, Jesus-less lyrics...the equivalent of cotton candy. You don't agree?!

      And by the way, if these bands put in the effort of creating an elaborate, artistic CD cover design...you're befuddled by anyone who contemplates the artwork?? I reasonably assume they intended a message of some sort and want us to notice and contemplate the (sometimes quite intricate) artwork. And then if I see a satanic baphomet pentagram or some other satanic symbol on the CD cover...I should what? Avert my eyes?

      If the Bible warns there are these extremely deceptive "wolf-sheep"...your strategy is to disregard the Bible's instruction to keep your eyes peeled...AND to send packing anyone else who attempts to follow the Bible in this regard?

      What effort do YOU make to ensure you aren't being drawn into a deceptive "scheme of the Devil"? These guys aren't going to conveniently perform a satanic ritual onstage for you. ALL wolf-sheep give EVERY appearance of being merely sheep, FYI.

      Unless the Bible is wrong, there ARE satanic "Christian" bands. Have you spotted any so far? Maybe you could help me out here.

      Postscript: By the way, I did read through the lyrics of every song on the As The World Bleeds CD. I would have to say, that although I lean towards them NOT being a wolf band...nevertheless, they follow the classic pattern for today's Christian bands which is that their lyrics are absolutely and exclusively comprised of "insider Christian lingo". Christian-ese, in other words. There isn't a snowball's chance any unchurched outsider is ever going to receive the Gospel message of salvation through faith in the Lord Jesus from reading these lyrics...and much less so, from listening (which I did briefly) to the music.

      Their lyrics are exclusively 'insider lingo'. I just think it is a HUGE mistaken trend in CCM these days. Jesus hung on a cross naked, beaten half to death, bleeding and dying...and Theocracy is too 'hip and edgy' (or something) to mention Him by name even ONCE on their entire CD?

      It could very well be that the guys with Theocracy are well-meaning, but...I don't agree with their 'insider lingo' philosophy at all. CCM has become this cozy, ingrown, exclusivist, Christian-ized thing.

      I happen to believe this CCM cultural trend of exclusivism is not an accident. It perfectly suits the designs of the Antichrist cabal's plans (described in detail by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse) of cordoning off and isolating the sheep...for their upcoming apostasy deception plot.

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    4. Thank God I saw this! I am with Matt TwoFour on this one ( I assume that's your name?)

      Satan (the devil) has infiltrated most music platforms to promote his ways via tobymac, thirdday and hawk nelson and theocracy. There is clearly an eye on the cover of the theocracy tobymac album. Thank You For Pointing This Out!

      I'll be reading your blog often.

      Please reply to this Matt!

      ~Jake

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    5. Thanks for the good words! No, "Matt TwoFour" is a pseudonym. When I first started my blog about satanic wolves, I was harrassed by hundreds of (apparent) satanists.

      So...Theocracy is one of your suspects? I only glanced quickly at one CD cover. At this point I really don't actively look for these wolves...unless one jumps out at me, like the ridiculously blatant "Eye On It" CD from Toby Mac.

      Thanks again for the encouraging words.

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    6. I wasn't smacking on you. I just think you're mistaken. Besides, you can't understand music by looking at the words. You actually have to listen to it to understand what it really says.
      As the World Bleeds has a lot of scriptural references that anyone could get unless they were (a) completely stupid or (b) live in Hollywood. That said, Theocracy's other albums are filled to the brim with spiritual matters. For example, Bethlehem and Emmanuel. Again, something that only an idiot could mistake for anything other than talking about Christ.
      Also, I think being an unchurched outsider might be an advantage for whoever's listening to theocracy's stuff. After all, an 'unchurched' outsider hasn't been indoctrinated yet, and is still completely open to the spiritual truth.

      As for the contemplating artwork... I got no problem with that. I just think it's weird that you look for eyes and obelisks and stuff almost exclusively on album covers. But, like i said, it's not my place to judge.

      I don't know of any satanic christian bands because 'christian' and 'satanic' are polar opposites. One cannot dwell within the other. Sorta like oil and water. I do know of christian bands/artists that I think are corrupted, though, such as MXPX or Katy Perry (Katy Perry considers herself to be a Christian artist... go figure.)

      Btw, I think jake_with_faith is a troll. That's just my thought, but then, I've seen lots of other people posting like him, so I could be wrong.

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    7. I was perusing the comments one last time when I saw my name mentioned here. Apparently, somebody (who didn't give their name away), referred to me as a troll? As in the pagan creature who would sit underneath bridges and not allow Christians across? I didn't come to this website to be called names. I came here to read about t--y m-c. Completely ridiculous.

      ~Jake

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    8. Anonymous--

      As far as the 'smacking'...you asked me, in effect, to take a look at those bands, I briefly took a look, you immediately chided me for looking. I just thought it was rather unfair...a bit silly.

      As far as "disagreeing" with me...this is where we get into the whole "biblical literacy" thing which I was talking about: It doesn't matter whether you use the oil/water analogy or not, Jesus' position is absolutely crystal clear and absolutely counter to your position--He states that there ARE spectacularly deceptive satanic "Christians" (Matthew 24)

      Yes, satanism and Christianity are polar opposites. That doesn't change the biblical fact taught directly by Jesus...that there are ingeniously disguised wolves among the flock. Your dismissal of this scenario is a direct rejection of point-blank Scripture...sorry to say.

      You seem to think a "satanic" band would only put out CDs that depict blatant satanism in their artwork and music. As I tried to explain--it's quite a bit more subtle than that.

      I'm not sure what you mean about "understanding the music". I took the time to read the lyrics of your chosen Theocracy album. I'm a musician myself (amateur)...heavily interacting with music all my life. Guitar-playing and singing, mostly in church settings. I have loved all kinds of CCM. Anyway...

      ...the lyrics were absolutely Gospel-less, Jesus-less. There is zero chance anyone would come to understand salvation through the Lord Jesus by listening to that CD.

      People who don't 'get' Christian-ese (the exclusive language of that CD)...aren't "completely stupid". They're simply unfamiliar with Christian "insider lingo".

      You talk about "scriptural references". I didn't see a scintilla of Scripture being quoted on that CD. Were you're talking about some of the CD's vague allusions to biblical concepts which the already-churched listeners can recognize and connect back to the Bible?

      Ok...and that would be utterly useless to the unchurched 'outsiders' who do NOT understand Christian lingo and who may have never cracked open a Bible even once in their life.

      I don't see an excuse in the world for 1) representing themselves as Christian yet 2) not mentioning "Jesus" even one single time on the entire CD.

      Like you said, Christian and secular/occultic music should be polar opposites. So...what's the difference between an Ozzy Osborne CD and some of these "Christian" CDs in terms of presenting Jesus as Lord, Savior, King of Kings, etc? Unfortunately, absolutely zilch.

      As a side note--You describe me as 'weird" but then say it's not your place to judge. Wait a minute--it's one of the other, isn't it? You can't make a "judgmental" statement that I and my behavior are weird...then claim you don't want to "judge". It's one or the other!

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    9. Matt ---

      Here are some examples of Christian bands - Flyleaf, Theocracy, Hawk Nelson, Thousand Foot Krutch. Here are some examples of what I believe are satanic bands - KISS, Slayer, Anthrax, Iron Maiden, and a couple of others that I literally cannot name in good conscience. The distinction is clear. Even with super-edgy Christian bands like Demon Hunter (which has a demon skull on one of its album covers - the point being that they kill demons, yada yada) are completely distinct from satanic groups.

      As for understanding music, it really doesn't matter to me if you read the lyrics or if you're an amateur musician. I am too. Big deal. I've been immersed in music for my entire life. By understanding music, I mean actually LISTENING. Forgetting your quest to find satanism in everything, and just listening. I get way more direction (from whom I think is God) when I do that than when I look for trouble. To date, the only negative feeling I've ever received about Christian music was my own personal dislike of uber-hardcore Christian rock (bands such as Showbread and Underoath). That, or just plain boredom at listening to the same insipid 'lyrics' over and over again.

      I'm not getting into the "jesus-lessness" debate. I saw what happened a few posts above, and I want no part of that. I disagree with your stance that this music can never lead someone to salvation, but that's my opinion. (BTW, listen to 'I AM'. And actually listen to the entire song. Don't just look at the lyrics.)

      And I never said Christian and secular music should be polar opposites. Secular and occult/satanic music are two completely different things. Just because it isn't 'christian' (which isn't always a saving grace) doesn't mean it's evil. Now, if it actually demonstrates evilitude (i don't think that's a word, and I don't care), like stuff from Iron Maiden, or Slayer, or those other despicable bands, then obviously it's satanic.
      A lot of secular bands, however, are generally harmless, depending on the strictness of your worldview.
      Now, as for the comparison between Ozzy Osborne and christian contemporary (let's use POD as an example)... You're really being blind. There is a HUGE difference between the two. Namely, Double-O is at the very least pretending to be a nigh-satanic freakball, and POD uses euphemisms for Christ so they can reach a bigger audience.
      Bands like Disciple, and POD, and Flyleaf, and Theocracy are, in my opinion, extremely effective for purposes of witnessing.

      And I never said that YOU were weird. Ever. I just said that I THINK it's weird that you stare at artwork looking for satanic symbols. And even then, that's not a judgment. That's an opinion. Frankly, I don't think weirdness defines your 'savation status', if you will. I just think it's odd, same way you might think my habit of rearranging things into patterns is weird. Doesn't make it wrong, just unusual.

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    10. To "Anonymous" September 7, 2012 8:06 PM--

      So you mention 4 bands you THINK are "Christian" (don't know how you figured that--they might just be pretending to be Christian just like millions of other pretend-Christians)...and 4 other bands you think are satanic (don't know how you've figured that--they might just be pretending to be satanic)...

      ...but you didn't point out the bands that pretend to be Christian but are actually satanic...the way Jesus has warned there would be. Where are THOSE bands?

      I don't quite understand. Did you read my comments? You're completely dodging the biblical reality of "wolves in sheep's clothing", i.e. those who appear to be Christian but are actually satanic.

      Not only might many of the bands be comprised of non-functioning "pretend-Christians" (in the passive sense)...beyond that, they might be leading a very aggressive, proactive double life...like a pastor who is secretly doing drugs and immorality on the side, and embezzling the church funds...or a Sunday School teacher who is actually practicing satanism. Or a musician who sings Christian songs but actually follows Lucifer, behind the scenes.

      What are you not 'getting' here?

      CCM bands are only comprised of Mother Teresa types? I mean...you're not only colliding with Jesus' advisories and the Bible's teachings with your counter-biblical oil/water arguments...you're also colliding with simple common sense, IMO.

      It doesn't take two minutes to figure out many people (satanic or otherwise) are operating behind a false "Christian" front...yet you're arguing this is impossible (oil/water) and that such "Christians" do not exist in CCM. The furthest thing from the truth.

      I didn't say it's a "big deal" to be a musician but...you're making this stipulation that one needs to "listen to the music". I don't agree. If I read the lyrics and see that they are Gospel-less and Jesus-less...what added insight will I get by "listening" to the music? Zip. I'm not following you at all here.

      You say I'm being "blind" with my Ozzy Osbourne comparison. Look more closely at exactly what I said--I said that IN TERMS OF EXPLICITLY PRESENTING JESUS BY NAME AND AS LORD AND SAVIOR...Theocracy, for example, on the CD you pointed me to, comes no closer to presenting the Gospel or presenting the Lord Jesus than an Ozzy CD, an Eagles CD, the Communist Manifesto, Mein Kampf, or How To Win Friends and Influence People.

      I say again, there is zip/zilch presentation of the Gospel, zip mention of Jesus...on that Theocracy CD. An unchurched, non-Christian doesn't have the slightest chance of finding the salvation of the Lord Jesus from listening to that CD.

      In fact, he literally has an EQUAL chance of hearing the Gospel by reading Mein Kampf or a Reader's Digest article on exercise. That is to say...zero chance.

      Not sure what you're referring to when you say you "want no part" of the "Jesus-less" controversy. (?) Frankly (and picture me saying this gently)...I wouldn't want any part of the "Jesus-less" debate either if I were Theocracy. It is utterly and completely indefensible for these people to claim they are "witnesses for Jesus and the Gospel"...and then never mention either.

      It's amazing the times we live in. Evangelical luminaries have now joined the madness of the rest of the world...when they can look you right in the eye (so to speak) and describe white as black, and black as white.

      Delete
  35. I have only this thing to say:

    You should stop worrying about wolf in sheep clothing, and start focusing on your own relationship with Christ. That is the only thing that matters in the end.

    And the second thing is, your judgmental and over analyzed anti CCM view makes no sense at all. You are trying to tell all the people who read this who's Christian, and who's not. That is not your job to judge, thankfully. You really think symbols on a CD cover, or how you hold your hand on a picture really means anything? Then I would suggest you to take a new look at your life. Jesus is the savior, we should focus on him, and not judge others or look for their "satanic" symbols and "weird" hand positions on posters. Stop being a hater.

    JC is King, and set to Judge. You are not, and you should really thank him for that.

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    1. Oh boy--here we go again. You see me doing something you think is wrong and think you're utterly free to say whatever "judgmental" rotten thing you can think of.

      I believe I see someone doing something wrong, yet I am NOT free to point it out??

      You need to re-read your comments. I think you're a little confused.

      Every single thing you just said...applies to YOU equally, by all rights...yet you broke every rule you just concocted, virtually the moment you concocted it!

      We should not "judge" others? OK---follow your own contrived unbiblical rules: Don't "judge" me. You've become a "hater" by your own twisted rationale.

      Meanwhile, Jesus has said to be on the look-out for these monsters...regardless of your anti-biblical "rebuke" that we are not to "worrying about wolves in sheeps clothing".

      I have NOT flatly declared Mac to be "non-Christian". That is a false accusation. I am simply pointing out the danger signs regarding this guy...and noting the fact he has breezily brushed aside the scriptural command to "avoid appearance of evil"...and have noted the fact that he has never (that I know of) declared Jesus as his Lord and Savior, as the King of Kings, Lord of Lords...nor that Lucifer is defeated and to be repudiated and is headed for the fiery judgment which he rightly deserves.

      Mac will...not...cough up...any such comments...nor anything within a million miles of such. His lyrics are absolutely Gospel-less and Jesus-less. There isn't the slimmest, slightest chance anyone will ever discover the message of salvation through faith in the Lord Jesus from Mac's cotton candy, Christian-ese lyrics.

      Delete
    2. Excuse me, Mr/Ms Anonymous. The BIBLE tells us to watch for wolves in sheep's clothing. Who gave you the authority to tell Matt not to be concerned about them?!?!?

      Delete
  36. I just read through some of the comments. I have to wonder - the people criticizing you - if they read the Bible at all. The Bible is very clear about the need to stay away from sorcery, wizardry, withcraft, etc. The OT is full of stories about what happened when the people did not listen to God over this. The Bible says to not have anything to do with the world, to be apart from it. Do not be conformed to the world, but be renewed by the transforming of your mind. To have friendship with the world is enmity with God. Philippians 4:8 says Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

    The Bible says that when you turn to Jesus Christ you are a new creature. He changes you. I know it's true because he changed me. My sanity was restored. My speech, priorities, my behavior is different. My old life does not appeal to me at all. Part of that was heavy metal and a very destructive life style. A miracle happened. Jesus Christ changed me. I see the christian heavy metal and it's defiant and depressing. Some of the lyrics are dark and strange. My heart feels so heavy and sad when I look at their blogs and facebook. They are leading people to another jesus.

    So when I see so-called christian bands that use backwards writing, runes, occult symbolism, Nazi symbolism, masonic symbolism, pictures of demons, one-eyed symbolism, serpents, members giving the satanic hand sign, and a host of other weird things - it sends a red flag. Why would they want to exhibit an appearance of evil to attract kids to Christ - it's insanity!

    Jesus told his disciples he was sending them out amongst wolves. Paul said when he left they'd be left among wolves. Nothing has changed. The wolves are out there to separate you from the Jesus Christ of the Bible. We need to know who they are. We need to be sober and alert, reading the Bible and praying.

    I know people who like heavy metal christian music. To tell them that it is not right, they don't understand. They can't. They don't read the Bible. They don't want to. I told one person that to have this one band play at church was bringing the world into the church and we are told not to do that - it only corrupts the church - she said she never heard that.

    She never head that because it's in the Bible!

    A poster said you were jealous because of people they were bringing to Christ. But it's not the Jesus Christ of the Bible these people are coming to. That Jesus is a Jesus that says you can do whatever you want. All you do is say I believe Jesus is the son of God and he died for me - and then that's it. And nothing changes. Their speech and behavior is like the world. It's lip service. That is what I have observed. That is the fruit of CCM that I have seen. But I am the weirdo.

    It's an interesting day when the person who believes what the Bible says and wants to obey it is a weirdo in the Christian community.

    Oh, yeah, and some of these christian CCM artists wear Obey clothing with the inverted crosses and other creepy symbols. Why?

    Symbols are the language of the occult. Their symbols are very meaningful and very powerful to them. We need to be aware and pay attention.

    I am very grateful for your hard work, Matt.

    And Yes, 'christians' pretending to be christian while overtly showing who they really work for and people saying how wonderful they are is so sad.

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    1. The sleepiness of church-going folks these days is astounding and startling to me.

      Your comments are extremely encouraging to me. I admit I haven't even looked very closely at the "Christian" heavy metal bands.

      On the rare occasion I am at a Christian book/music store, I can see out of the corner of my eye, the massive occult symbolism on the their CD covers. I would suspect these are (what I would call) "wolf" bands. Then again, there may be many of them who are just ignorant about occult symbolism. I don't know.

      Certainly, this "Whosoever" outfit...their poster consists of massive, wall-to-wall satanic symbolism.

      Praise God that he brought you out of the darkness into salvation. May God bless you in redirecting your life (assuming the change has happened recently?).

      You know..the idea Toby mac is "leading people to Jesus"...you can't lead people to Jesus if you never MENTION Jesus. His lyrics are Jesus-less and Gospel-less. But I think you're right---many folks refer to "Jesus" in vain. It reminds of the Bible's prediction--"many will say, Lord, Lord, look at all we did in your name".

      I'll have to look into this "Obey" clothing. Hadn't heard of it. C28 products are certainly loaded down with occult symbolism.

      Thanks again.

      Delete
    2. Looking at the C28 website, they have a new clothing line called B IT by Toby Mack's drummer. Interesting. Looking at the bookstore I see they promote new age/contemplative/emergent authors.

      The way I see it, Toby Mack is just another CCM tool for the ecumenical new age process of bringing everyone together in unity and diversity for the one world religion and preparation for the antichrist.

      I was reading another website about Toby Mack and they were saying how he sings about unity and diversity, etc. - new age code words. So it makes sense. Satan wants to keep people away from the Jesus of the Bible. Let them THINK they are worshiping Jesus, but they really aren't. They don't know the Bible, so they easily believe a lie. The Bible says that God is bringing a strong delustion on those who refuse the believe the truth - which is God's word.

      Toby Mack's use of occult symbolism is just his way of signaling that he is one of them.

      Is the number 23 associated with chaos, too?



      Delete
    3. I too am one of those weirdos. Sad when a Christian feels like they don't fit in at church.

      Delete
  37. You're kidding right? This is satire right? Alas, I don't think it is. I suppose "The Davinci Code" is all true, too, right? Give me a huge break. Let me guess, the King James version is the only holy version of the Bible, too. This is paranoid, too much time on my hands, gonna save the world from pictures hogwash.

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    1. Once again, another visitor to my blog who has failed to do any preparatory reading/investigation such as I carefully advise at the very top of this article...and who is now sloppily shooting from the hip.

      Even WITHOUT the advised prep reading...yes, the "chaos" symbol on the cover of Third Day's CD is a blatantly satanic signaling. It is what it is. No conspiracy theories -- just plain fact -- Third Day depicts numerous satanic symbols on their CD covers...AND they refuse to answer questions about them. The warning lights should go on. Glibly dismissing these plain indicators is wildly reckless.

      Yes, maybe Third Day merely wants to have "cool looking" symbols on their CD cover...then again, maybe they're satanic. Ridiculing the idea of "wolves in sheep's clothing" who have deliberately infiltrtated God's flock...is to ridicule the Bible's warnings about such.

      Look closely at this biblical expression "wolves in sheep's clothing". It means there are satanic wolves who APPEAR to be "Christian". You're thinking wolves will conveniently have horns and a pitchfork so you can recognize them from a mile away?

      I don't know WHAT the full story is on Third Day...but to actually chastise people for pointing out plain-as-day occult symbols portrayed on their published materials...pretty bizarre. Where's the discernment? You think CCM is just a great big happy Disneyland where Christian young people can happily romp around with not a care in the world? You're making a tragic error.

      No, I don't prescribe compulsory KJV usage. I use all kinds of translations, and do my own translations as well. (A lot of DIY Greek translation literature out there.) Good luck with the reckless 'pegging' though. :-)

      Delete
  38. You're sick. And you have gone quite a stretch to make these accusations. I would question your motives, your contention, and your God. You obviously have far too much time on your hands. Recall in history it was the Christians who burn the innocent at the stake for witchcraft thu histeria, wild accusations, and God!

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    1. If you're secularist in your world view (which you seem to be)...than I'm not sure what you're complaining about. Who doesn't realize there are occult practitioners throughout the world? They're all over the place. Drive through any town in the US -- there are "palm readers" every half block, as one example. From your comments, one would think I was proposing belief in unicorns -- lol.

      Why would you be upset if Toby Mac were a secret occult practitioner? I would think your argument would be: "So what? Who cares if Mac has occult dimensions?"

      Yes, I am aware that mainstream media "history books" tell tales of horror about "witch hunts" in early America. I've never looked into it from the revisionist angle (which is my normal approach -- an assumption that mainstream media produces almost nothing but falsehood and propaganda)...

      ...but my simple noting of Toby Mac's secretive, camouflaged occult symbol presentations while simultaneously claiming to be a "Christian"...is perfectly reasonable.

      If you're big on exposing Christian hypocrites...why don't you help me out here? I'm just a simple, small-time guy who has noticed these hypocritcial indicators and have sought to point it out.

      Delete
    2. THANK-YOU!!! I was waiting for SOMEONE to show some sense. I'm so sick of all these people who sit around judging everyone BUT themselves.

      Delete
    3. Wait a minute -- you just "judged" me. You broke your own rule. You're now "sickening" yourself, I presume?

      I have NOT pronounced final "judgment" on Toby Mac, for the record. I am simply pointing out that he repeatedly presents satanic symbols and signalings. I therefore have suspicions and concerns. No dogmatic conclusions or pronouncments.

      Delete
  39. Hypocracy abounds, it is ever present in the words and deeds of the Slick Mega church Pastors with their flashing lights and plastic grins. The dime a dozen stories of the drug addict that found Jesus and replaced his addiction for another. Passages from the bible are like the endless tides thrown out to prove some point of rightiousness. You read the bible SO WHAT. Pastors live in houses that they paid for by using the word of God to their means. They scare the followers that they are not holy enough GIVE more, They speak in hushed tones on grand stages, and yet people die every day never knowing something, someone greater than ourselves loves them. You point to symbols and slick artists trying to prove the devil in the details and yet look around you. If your reaching for a sign, I doubt some hat has a hidden meaning. In the end I don't believe God gives a good damn for all this nonsense.

    ReplyDelete
  40. And my son, upon who's FB page I saw this little link, is in one of these Christian bands (not the ones listed above) But on a parr, he and I have spoken about this. A symbol, a gesture, is not reflective of what's in ones heart. You take for granted what you're saying is true.

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    1. You're making so many assumptions about me, I can barely keep up. Fact is...I'm waaaay ahead you when it comes to the matter of super-slick super-churches with their super-slick money-grubbing super-pastors. 99% of Evangelical churches are completely screwed up, quagmired in materialism, triumphalism, snobbery, and Starbucks addiction. Your kneejerk presumptions about my supposed views are silly and prejudicial, sorry to say.

      And when you say God doesn't care about "all this nonsense"...which "nonsense?? He doesn't care if practicing occultists falsely front as "Christian"? Even YOU obviously have grave concerns about hypocrisy in the "Christian" world. Why wouldn't God have concerns about occult 'fronters'? I'm not following your logic.

      And when you say I "take for granted" that what I am saying "is true"...you are precisely wrong. That is exactly what I do NOT do...is form dogmatic conclusions and presumptions. In my blogs I am simply observing this bizarre phenomenon of "Christian" leaders (whether in music or elsewhere) who are secretly signaling occult allegiance but publicly claiming Christian allegiance...and I let the chips of evidence then fall where they may. I don't dogmatically declare anyone to be a "witch" or a satanist.

      This apparent occult fronting is just another manifestation of the age-old problem of organized Christianity--galloping hypocrisy. If you could calm yourself down from what appears to be something close to rage...I think you would see you and I have a lot of agreement. Though...with your mention of a Christian son who plays in a Christian band...I'm still unable to tell what your orientation actually is.

      Delete
  41. My orientation is thusly, I have had an extremely BAD experience in Christian Churches as a young person with a slick talking preacher with wild stories and wandering hands. In my experience they have always been way worse because you couldn't see them coming. I don't really like "Christians". I chose not to raise my child in the churches for lack of faith in men. I prefer people of faith who don't take the bible busting stance. I take offense however, with your accertion about poses, hats, and symbols. My son being in the industry has pointed out, that because you have faith and the billing "Christian" artist that people will look to tear you down especially amoung Christians. It's like they take ownership, and then expect the artists have to stand up to their scrutiny or they are not "Christian" enough. That is where the danger lies. You don't know that was the intent behind the artistry or the pose. You see the Devil in everything because you are looking for it. I don't accept that. I think that is silly. And yes I think God is a bigger man than to worry about who is worshipping Satan, after all he did give us free choice, and then uncondittional love right? And I have heard Toby Mac is a pretty nice guy, why do you seek to tear him down? Do you actually know what's behind his poses? Are you saying you have the power of intuittive insight? Or are these just your baseless assumptions to tear down an artist because you dissagree with him? If you have some sort of proof, then by all means trot it out let's take a look at it. I could really give a rats ass about mega churches, but most artist express themselves honestly, sure money and fame follow, but that too falls away in the end. I am not a Christian, but a humble follower of a man who is far greater than any of us, and yet loves us anyway.

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    1. Well...given your story, I don't mind you venting some anger at me. My argument though...is that we are really on the same side. I can't tell you how many abuse victims of Evangelicalism and other organized religion (Catholicism, for example) that I have come across...and who have verified the reality of a huge satanic infiltration of conservative church culture.

      Again, your theory about me being a grump who likes to tear down Toby Mac...off the mark. First of all, I'm not "tearing" anything. I am simply pointing out that he keeps presenting satanic symbols and signals...along with dozens of other CCM artists.

      It sounds to me like you might understand my thesis better, if you did a wider reading. At the top of this article, I linked to some chapters from my e-book. I don't think you're quite getting the 'big picture'.

      Satanic wolves who have ingeniously infiltrated Evangelicalism...are a reality...and are clearly indicated in the Bible. What do you think is ultimately behind all of the abuse? Maybe not every single instance...but I know of many churches (some right here where I live) where the entire thing is a satanic front operation. Virtually all of the staff, from the senior pastor on down...committed Luciferians in disguise. Huge and systematic abuse, satanic rituals held in the 'sanctuary' in the dark of night, the whole nine yards.

      What do you think is behind the abuse epidemic in the catholic church? Google "Malachi Martin"-- a Catholic whistleblower.

      To simply dismiss with "well, he seems like a nice guy"...come on now. Ex-occultists will tell you (with whom I've had innumerable discussions)--satanic wolf infiltrators ALWAYS come across very, very pleasantly. That's why the deception is so astonishing. (I hasten to add---that doesn't mean when you see a nice person, you begin to suspect they're occultic.)

      Delete
  42. Well, ok maybe I jumped to the conclussion that you were like all the rest of the liars in the world of organized religion. And yes I have a rage that boils right up given my past experience. Going from an innocent young girl, to eyes wide open over night was quite a jolt. I was not ready to be thrust into the world of liars at such a young age. Now I just assume they are all alike. If it is your mission to expose these plastic, creepy, pedophiles then my hat is off to you. I would caution be very careful you know who you are pointing a finger at first.

    ReplyDelete
  43. Oh and btw My Chiropractor, a Deacon in the Mormon church makes advances all the time. Not very subtle ones at that. I would love to hear what you think of Mormons. I have my own opinions that are very unkind. Why, you ask would I continue to go to this man??? Because it amusses me and validates what scumbags they all are! Besides I am a horse trainer I could knock his ass out anytime I have to! God Speed to you.

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    1. If you kick over the rocks in the Evangelical world, a whole lot of stuff goes slithering for the shadows. Did you see the latest about Jessica Simpson's dad, for example? This guy was a Bible church pastor and with a lovely family.

      So he quits his pastorate to promote his daughters' music careers (of course, the 'worldliness' and risque-ness which he pushed them into, he being a 'church pastor, is quite dubious and bizarre)...then, lo and behold, he is now apparently leaving his wife and family for a teenage 'boy toy'. I believe these "really out there" perversions coming from within the conservative church world are indications of satanists who have infiltrated the church.

      Additionally, according to my information...very, very few people in the entertaiment world rise to the level of Jessica Simpson without being mind-controlled through satanic ritual abuse.

      As far as "pointing fingers"...the only thing I'm pointing at are the satanic symbols being publically displayed by prominent people who present themselves as "Christian" (in the music world or elsewhere in the Christian community). If they have the audacity to display them, I'll have the "audacity" to point them out!

      Mormonism, identically to Evangelicalism, has satanic origins. Of course, Mormonism is much less subtle and much more blatant. The satanic doctrines (such as their teaching that Jesus and Lucifer are brothers) and the blatant Masonic/satanic symbolism which blankets the Mormon world (the outside and inside of their buildings, and their other various symbiols)...make that quite clear. Not to mention if you track their history and their leadership.

      Yes, I believe even modern-day Evanglicalism ultimately traces back to satanic agents. Discussion for another day.

      God bless you too! I hope you can delve a bit into some of my recommended links sometime.

      Delete
  44. ~Labby
    Hi Matt. hope you are well. If readers are struggling to wrap their brains around the symbolism and want to dismiss it (because most Christians often are loving and forgiving), even if they should not, then here is yet another. In addition to the Whosoevers "ministry" that BibleBeliever pointed out on her blog, there is another album with the "Eye" art. Flyleaf's newest. It's amazing how the artist always has a reasonable explanation as to why they used it, like Toby Mac. How many is it going to take before Christians realize that they are probably being duped? Here are two links:
    http://www.facebook.com/flyleafmusic?fref=ts
    http://site.flyleafmusic.com/

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    1. I asked my daughter about Flyleaf. She says they're one of those bands that started of as "sort-of-Christian-ish"...then she and the kids at her youth group (at our church) noticed they use foul language during their interviews.

      It's amazingly murky and gray and vague out there in the CCM world these days. Groups that fade in and out of the "Christian" category. One minute, they're "Christian", the next minute, they're not.

      But yes, their CD cover is quite chilling and blatant...and yes, I am also amazed at the blindness and lack of discernment among church-goers. I'll have to include that Flyleaf CD in my next blog article.

      I have to sort of apologize-- I went though a brief period of rather intense stress...when there were 3 or 4 commenters who were making a concerted effort to harass and create deception and confusion in my comments section (couldn't quite tell if they were satanic or not)...then simultaneously, I seemed to have been locked out of my own blog. I thought my blog was being subjected to some kind of sophisticated manipulation...but in the end it merely required a bit of routine de-bugging...and the harassers went away. But I was pretty stressed. Thanks for letting me vent a bit on some emails...but also sorry to have dumped on you!

      Delete
  45. ~Labby
    No problem, my friend. I'd have been stressed out too with all of that. Totally understandable. Quite frankly, I can only take so much before I weary of it. I don't know how you do it.

    ReplyDelete
  46. This all sounds like a bunch of "demons on doorknobs" thinking. I've followed TobyMac's music and ministry since the early days of DCTalk and have been to numerous concerts. I have all of his CDs and know all the words and understand his lyrics. You obviously have listened to very little and I would bet have never attended any of his concerts. How could someone read from the Holy Bible explaining the way of salvation leading many to Christ and be some Luciferian??? You are NUTS! Plain and simple. Why don't you just work on your own relationship with the Lord (assuming you have one) and leave those who are actually doing good (leading people to Jesus and singing his praises) alone and quit causes division in The Church. I will pray for you. You need it!!!

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    1. Ah, another reader who has failed to do the recommended prep reading which I carefully advise at the top of this article.

      I hadn't heard the expression "demons on doorknobs". I had heard about "demons behind every bush"...and of course, every Bible student knows there IS a demon behind every bush. The world is crawling and teeming with evil spirits. The world is beset and besieged by the Devil and his minions. Not sure why you, an apparent believer, would be ridiculing basic biblical fact.

      You need to turn your question around. If Mac is (as you think) a genuine Christian...why does he continually give indication of satanic allegiance? Why the continual posing for photos, showing only one eye? Why the "eye" on a DC Talk album ten years ago, and another "eye" on the recent "Eye On It" CD?

      You don't think satanic wolves who have become pastors or Christian singers read from the Bible in front of their audiences?

      If a satanist openly signals allegiance to Satan through dozens and dozens of publicly displayed symbols...all he has to do is read from the Bible at a meeting...and he is immediately and automatically cleared?? That's some amazingly poor discernment.

      Wolves "read from the Bible" all day long. Assuming Mac may be Luciferian...what did you think he was going to do at his concerts? Sacrifice a goat onstage during a satanic ritual?

      The whole idea of being a "wolf in sheep's clothing' is to fool people. Hello? They ARE going to pray and read the Bible.

      I don't suspect people of being satanic when they pray and read the Bible. I suspect them of being satanic if they pray and read the Bible AND have a thousand satanic symbols and signals they're constantly displaying. Call me Sherlock, perhaps?

      You claim Toby is "leading people to Christ". His lyrics certainly aren't. They're absolutely Gospel-less. There isn't the slightest chance anyone could ever come to an understanding of the Gospel of salvation through faith in the Lord Jesus...from reading Mac's lyrics.

      All those hundreds of homemade Toby Mac Youtubes and not a single one which shows him "preaching the Gospel" at one of his concerts. Therefore, I suspect that the way in which you define "Gospel presentation" is woefully lacking. But I'm willing to stand corrected if anyone can ever show evidence.

      It's quite ironic that satanists seem to have a more accurate understanding of Bible theology than average church-goers...because they know full well (as Bible students should but often don't) that simply "praying a prayer" doesn't make you a shoo-in for heaven. Wolves will pray prayers with people all day long. The Devil (and Toby Mac also?) doesn't care HOW many prayers you pray...as long as you fall away in the Great Apostasy in the end.

      Are you not aware of the grand strategy of all these satanic Christian leaders who are conspiring to create this huge Apostasy Plot? Read Matthew 24. There, Jesus describes very large numbers of spectacularly deceptive satanic "Christian" leaders who perpetrate this deadly deception.

      When you ridicule folks like me as "nuts" because of our belief there are satanic wolves who have deceptively infiltrated God's flock,you are therefore ridiculing the Bible and ridiculing Jesus' warnings about these covert satanists. Read Matthew 24 carefully and repeatedly.

      Delete
  47. His arms are bent.
    Look, Barney, Arms were made to bend. Don't you ever fold your arms?
    You can only see one eye:What's wrong with one eye showing? You ever covered your eye? I have. OMGosh. I must be evil.
    plaid shirt:I have one and I wear it. I must be evil
    Black and white:My fave colors. AM I EVIL??
    You guys need to focus on yourself and your relationship with Jesus. Not on Tmac's. Read the bible. And, skillet isn't bad either. Their songs have saved my life. yeah. It's called suicide. Look, why don't you show some love?

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    1. "Barney"? Lovely name-calling from someone who presumes to counsel me on spirituality. Hmmm.

      Yet another reader who has failed to do the prep reading (carefully indicated at the top of this article). No, not all "plaid shirts" are evil...and if you thus need to exaggerate in your rebuttal, that would seem to speak for itself, no?

      There ARE satanic wolves in sheep's clothing who utilize extremely diabolical and ingenious counterfeiting methods. If you don't like the people on my suspect list...how about YOU point out a popular, well-known Christian leader who has a facade so convincing that the majority of the Christian community has been fooled? Point out even one. I'm standing by.

      To ridicule the concept of spectacularly deceptive "Christian" wolves...is to ridicule the Bible's concept..and is to ridicule Jesus' warnings in the Olivet Discourse. Wow-- how did you pull THAT off?

      Delete
  48. Hi Matt. I recently discovered your blog and I think it's terrific in Jesus name.
    In the article on Toby Mac, you mentioned Max Lucado. There is some occult symbolism on his book covers. It is subtle like Michael W. Smith stuff, but I believe it's real on several of his book covers.The book Fearless is one in particular.
    Keep up the great work and God bless you in Jesus name.

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    1. Yes, I noticed that "Jesus-is-Lord" website pointing out some of Lucado's book covers. It looks increasingly bad. Yes, the book cover for "Fearless" looks like a truncated pyramid with the floating triangle, virtually identical to the ancient satanic symbolism on the One Dollar bill. Thanks for the info! And thanks for the good words.

      Delete
  49. I totally agree that the occult is everywhere and even in the ''Christian music'' industry and the sad thing is that people prefer to sell their albums and to sell more they need to be like the world so they do like the world but the Bible says in Matthew 6:24 '' No one can serve two masters.Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.''

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  50. http://breathecast.christianpost.com/files/news/news_1251980776_Awake_Skillet.jpg Check that Skillet awake album they took the eye of Horus also know as the all seeing eye symbol which is occult and as nothing to do with the eye of God but which is the eye of lucifer.

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    1. Yes, I'd seen that Skillet CD cover before. I feel like I'm getting behind in publishing all these satanic symbols on CCM album covers. In fact, I'm going to belatedly insert this photo right beneath my section on Derek Webb of Caedmon's Call...in my "Yet More Occultism in High Places" article (a bit more than a third of the way down the page). Check it out! And thanks for the reminder.

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  51. Hello I Came across your post and I appreciate your research. This issue has to be exposed and taken seriously and unfortunately many prefer the head in the sand point of view. I would like to point out that there are numerous people who play a role in the development of the music and the graphic art.

    Nashville like any other city that produces influential media is riddled with people involved with the masonic(among other things) at all levels. Their job is to corrupt and infiltrate and most of the artists are utterly clueless. As far as TobyM he has so much masonic imagery going all the way back to the beginning of his career(what does the DC in DC Talk really mean anyway?) that I have little doubt that he is likely a mason. But does he even realize what he is a part of because most of them don't have a clue. They are lied to from the beginning and many think its a Judeo Christian brotherhood. I also wonder about John Cooper who basically is Skillet. I'd listened to him since their first album and stopped after they went mainstream but he worshiped Jesus with all he had early on. Maybe its just wishful thinking but I think many of the artists are in the industry and are not discerning that those working with them serve a completely different agenda.

    The masonic influence has also been extremely influential in the Christian church(all denominations) and I think it is what Jesus warned us about when he was speaking of the wheat and tares and especially the sheep and goats. He said that to pull up the tares would also pull up the wheat and so both must harvested and judgment would take place at that time. He also said to be wise as serpents and innocent as doves, which is what you are doing (and I've been on a heck of a learning curve for a while trying to do). We unfortunately aren't taught most of these things in church especially these days. I wonder why?

    Thanks and keep it up, CF

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  52. WHO ARE YOU to judge these people/bands? You don't know how many people got to know God through their music!! This is so sad that people just can't listen to godly stuff and just spend their time to search for occultism everywhere! I don't know if they are or not in bad things like that, but whatever, their songs make my relationship with God stronger, this I can't deny, so... they work for God! OMG!

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    1. Wait a minute -- didn't you just "judge" me? And you say you don't care if they "are or not" satanic? Okey-dokey then. Most of the church world has fallen into a deep, deep snooze. If you think satanic CCM artists can "make your relationship with God stronger"...think again.

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  53. What gets your attention gets you. It's clear that YOUR life and YOUR focus are squarely on the occult- to the point you spend HOURS looking for things to complain about.

    There are two ways to be controlled by something. Working hard to get it and working hard to stay away from it. Either way, your life is given over to it.

    You've given your life over to the occult. It's a shocking revelation but you know it's true.

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    1. Your statement ("what gets your attention gets you") is contradictory. My blog got YOUR attention. Using your own illogic...I have now completely taken over your life and you are now my prisoner, lol.

      Your "complaint" (to borrow a term) is silly. I have a blog. I report suspicious indications of covert satanism in the church world. It hasn't created some sort of unhealthy balance in my life. I have a family, wife, children, a business, hobbies, golf, travel...the works. Anyone who has a blog is therefore "possessed" by the blog? That's quite the conspiracy theory.

      You're simply piggy-backing on this age-old notion which floats around the conservative church world...that anyone who undertakes to study demons, the Devil and satanism is going to become obsessed and/or even possessed by the Devil.

      You are literally claiming that if anyone spends time studying the Devil and his schemes (per the Bible's instructions, by the way)...they will become possessed by the Devil. Good grief. The Middle Ages are calling -- they want their superstitions back!

      Brother, your views are pure superstition and anti-biblical. I've studied the warnings of Jesus in the Olivet Discourse and I try to pass those warnings along. It's a matter of eternal life and eternal death. Yes, I've spent some "hours" in the effort. That's what I do here. (?)

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  54. Could the "Lions Paw" pertain to puttin our right hand over our hearts during the pledge of allegiance?!

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    1. I'm sure it is. I imagine you could find knowledgeable insights from ex-Masons and the like.

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  55. Matt, I have been reading your work and i do see disturbing things. I have not come full circle on this yet... I am now aware of this symbolism in mainstream....well everything.I have to by my nature take it slowly and prayerfully, however you have opened my eyes.Interesting one of the bands that has a lot of dealing with Tobymac is Skillet a "Christian band" there fan club is called the pan heads! i know skillet = pan but going to the double meaning thing.Look at the song monster and the imigery...creepy stuff reminds me of the scion commercial.Much prayers

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  56. WOW, this information is mind blowing. I never knew Toby Mac used all that symbolism. I never buy his CD's but I have his music in my iTunes.

    I wanted to ask if you have looked into Rebecca St. James and her brothers' band, For King and Country? She came to our church last year for her "She" conference and there was NO gospel presentation at all. It had nothing to do with Jesus. And I saw a picture of her brothers posing with the New Ager, Roma Downey. And endorsing their TV series on "The Bible" that is going on the History Channel right now. Here is a link about how Downey and Burnett are false christians that the church (and focus on the family) is trying to pass off as real. I would really like to hear more about wolves in sheeps clothing. I go to a calvary, and I am so upset about General Boykin coming and with the whole Ergun Caner scandal. I want to see the church speak up and warn the sheep. Like a good shepherd. Thanks for your blog and I loved your book!!!

    http://thelasthiker.wordpress.com/2013/03/06/wake-up-me-screaming-then-apologizing-for-some-strange-reason/

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  57. Also, What about Hillsong United? I LOVE their worship songs but when their Aftermath album came out, I noticed a ton of triangles and upside down geometric pictures all over it.

    There new album coming out is called "Zion" and it looks so desolate, like the pictures were taken in a creepy desert wilderness. I have a weird feeling about them right now.

    I found out that the Brian Houston's wife promotes plastic surgery and external shallowness, and I saw a picture of Joel Houston the lead worship singer drinking hard alcohol with a bunch of bikini girls (one is his wife). But still weird image--when I used to think of him as pouring over his Bible for the next beautiful worship song to write. Anyways, I don't want to be a "sin sniffer" but I also don't want to be led away. Especially since worship is such a holy thing--to let the enemy have any part of that in my life. You know???

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    1. Hey, thanks for the good words! I don't know anything about Hillsong. Their CD covers don't look too bad.

      The ironic thing that has been occurring to me recently is...that you don't have to be an out-and-out satanic wolf in order to be a full-blown participant in the apostatizing process in the conservative church world.

      In other words, satanic or not, all these CCM'ers and other Christian leaders who promote the whole Starbucks/Disneyland happy-happy-bubble version of Evangelicalism...with it's dreamy "carried-off-to-heaven-on-flowery-beds-of-ease" PreTrib Rapture...the whole "support the troops" mantra--which is equal to supporting the Antichrist's globalist militarism and world of warring...and the whole Dominionist idea that this is the golden age of Evangelicalism....they're carrying out the Antichrist's program just as effectively!

      But it's still interesting (is "disturbing" a better word?) to come across these deviously disguised wolves.

      I haven't seen any evidence on St.James. She has been pretty closely associated with Michael Smith. She's probably just another of these mainstream CCM'ers who go along with the program. Thanks again!

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  58. Okay, most of this stuff is just a witch hunt. Seriously, you and jesusissavior.com really need to find a better hobby than bashing innocent people.

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    1. I'm just agreeing with the Olivet Discourse and Jesus' comments there. He said many satanic Christian leaders would emerge in the last days. So I guess Jesus is also "bashing innocent people"? If you don't like my line-up of suspected wolves...then how about YOU point out these satanic leaders Jesus indicated. Name just one cleverly concealed satanic wolf who is thought to be a "Christian" by the Christian community. Just one. Or was Jesus prophecy wrong?

      There ARE satanists in the world...and they DO conceal themselves within the Christian community. It's a great hiding place. The whole concept is in the Bible. You know..."wolves in sheep's clothing". Again, I challenge you to point out just one of these spectacularly deceptive and concealed wolves in a top leadership position. I'm standing by.

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    2. Jesus never mentioned any christian leaders. Christianity had not yet formed. Thus the Olivet Discourse could apply to any teachers anywhere.

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    3. Jesus-following (i.e. "Christianity") began the very moment Jesus had followers. Not sure how you're missing that.(?) Was there some 'paperwork' that needed to be filled out or something, in your mind? You're losing me. :)

      You have completely ignored the 'context' of the passage: The disciples (i.e. the first "Christians, the first Jesus-followers) came to Him asking what they should look out for in the last days. Jesus said to look out for the "false prophets" because many will be deceived and only those among His followers who are careful will avoid the deception.

      The context is so obvious...your claim is very puzzling. Not to mention....non-Christians are ALREADY deceived so therefore the 'false prophets' would having nothing to deceive them about in the first place!

      Jesus plainly states "[you disciples, you Jesus-followers] see to it that no one deceives you"...and then goes on to describe the deception attempts of the false prophets. Come on now.

      And you haven't answered the biblical argument that there ARE infiltrating wolves in the church. You seem to have a general objection to the idea of spectacularly deceptive wolves...which is an objection to Bible truth. (?)

      If you don't like my 'suspects list' then point to even one ingeniously, diabolically deceptive wolf who is currently fooling the length and breadth of Bible-believing church-dom. I'm standing by.

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  59. He came to set the captive FREEEEE! Maybe someday you will let him set you free. Yes, there are demons in this world. Yes, there are people that dabble in the occult. But there isn't a demon under every bush. There's no conspiracy by the artists you mention, only a low budget. Most of the "visual markers" you mentioned on the cover art are generic computer desktop publishing items. There's not much to choose from if you've ever tried to create flyers, this website, etc. DC Talks eye has to do w/the lyrics. He has his eye on the prize by keeping his eye on Christ. You find that Satanic? Seriously? If all you have to do is tear down your fellow siblings in Christ...well I'm sad for you. YOU are the one living in bondage. God said to spend your time lifting up, building up, edifying...well lets just quote Him, "Whatsoever things are pure. Whatsoever things are lovely. Whatsoever things are of GOOD REPORT, think on these things." Doesn't sound like He's telling any of us to pick apart each other and undermine others testimonies. If you don't like the music? Don't listen to it. If you don't think it's holy enough for you, find something that is, then share that. These people have taken the talents God gave them and USED them instead of burying them in the ground. God will tell them WELL DONE MY GOOD AND FAITHFUL SERVANTS. What's He gonna say to you when your time comes? Do you think your hyper-obsession w/satanic anything is going to make Him proud of you? Don't spend so much time looking for your enemy when your eyes should be focused on your Father. Ask Him to speak to your heart about these individuals that cause you such concern. Maybe He like tapping his foot to some lively praise on occasion. Isn't that what Psalms was all about???? You know, you can READ the lyrics to the songs w/o listening to the music. If you don't like the genre, you will undoubtedly find fault with it. However, if you read what pours from their hearts to our Father, you might be overwhelmed. Just a thought.

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    1. OK so...I'm expressing concerns and criticizing the behavior of certain CCM artists...and you, in turn, are also expressing concerns and criticizing my behavior...but when I do it, it is a terrible wrong...yet when you do it, you're in the right? Get back to me when you figure it out. :)

      For example -- the Scripture which you quote and have horrendously misapplied ("whatsoever things are of good report, think on these things")...isn't my stuff supposedly of 'bad report' and aren't you giving a substantial amount of "thought" to it...thus breaking your own pseudo-rule? I could go on. Your comments are a long line-up of self-contradictions. It is indeed a very biblical thing to be on the look-out for the infiltration of enemy wolves.

      Are you literally in denial that satanic agents have deviously infiltrated God's flock? If you DON'T deny it...then how would you recommend we go about uncovering these dangerous wolves? Jesus instructs us to be on the look-out for these wolves (read Matt.24).

      Jesus has stated in point-blank fashion that there ARE many satanic wolves who have infiltrated the flock. If you don't like my suspects list...just where ARE all those hugely deceptive wolves among God's people? Point out even one single suspect...a wolf who has been spectacularly deceptive such that virtually the entire church world has been fooled. I'll be standing by.

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    2. @ Anonymous July 2, 2013 at 10:13 PM :

      Anonymous, instead of launching ad hominem attacks at Matt, try consulting Scripture and you will clearly see that it REPEATEDLY warns of wolves in sheep's clothing purposely doing the work of satan under the guise of Christianity & before I became born-again and saved by Jesus Christ, I am ashamed to admit that I knew individuals who knowingly engaged in this. Do not dismiss this...yes it IS indeed a satanic conspiracy, but it is NOT a theory--it is a real, malevolent plan that is actively in full force and targets lukewarm Christians who feel attending church on Sunday and listening to the pastor substitutes for authentic study of the divinely-inspired, preserved Word of God (King James Holy Bible). Humble yourself and ask Christ to reveal the truth to you. Heed his Word: "Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world."...1 John 4:1 KJB

      "For such [are] false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.".....2 Corinthians 11:13-15 KJB

      Finally, as a born-again servant of our Savior Jesus Christ, we ARE commissioned to call out wolves in sheep's clothing; it is 100% Biblical.

      "But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.".........Ezekiel 33:6 KJB

      Your sister in Christ, Elise

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  60. hahaha.,, what a coincidences.!! i think it's just an over reaction.!! :) totally i appreciate all their songs (toby mac, Michael Smith) so,, what's the matter if i draw a triangle.? or i close my right eye while i open my left eye.? it depends always on your heart motivations., dont ever judge if you dont know them, try to know their testimonies, their goals in their life not their simple mistakes doing those such thing you see.,, i suggest that you know more Jesus NOT His Creations.,, GOD BLESS US :'D

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    1. I've expressed concerns and criticism about some of these CCM people...and you have expressed concern/criticism about me. But when I do it I'm being "judgmental"...and you're not? You can't have it both ways. if it's OK for you to express some concerns...then it's OK for me to express some concerns.

      Whether yours or my concerns are correct is another story. But it's OK to have concerns about occult symbol display...and it's OK to have concerns about categorizing people as "occultist" when they may, in fact, not be.

      The problem, with your complaint is...it's not true. I haven't 'concluded' anyone is satanic. I'm simply saying there are dozens if not hundreds of CCM bands and musicians these days who are displaying satanic symbolism on their published materials. Just because you have no familiarity with occult symbolism, the Lion's Paw, or satanic "runes"...is neither here nor there.

      It's a bit flippant, don't you think? Briefly browsing through one blog article as you have...then rushing to "judgment" (to borrow a term).

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  61. Hi Matt:
    I read your book over year ago and you changed the way I look at the world. I thank you for the time you took to research and write the book, as well as your other articles. I came back tonight to look up info about Toby Mac since I heard that he had gone to school at Liberty. I wanted to see if that was one of the "christian schools" that have been connected with the Mind Control programming. I read some of the comments people have been making. Don't get sidetracked by them. Keep doing what you do - write. You have changed my way of thinking and probably many others as well. Don't throw pearls to swine. Some people don't want the truth. Don't waste your time. The truth is usually not popular. God bless you and thank you so much. Look forward to much more from you.

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    1. Thanks for the kind words. Liberty is the late Jerry Falwell's college. Haven't noticed any particular 'mind control' or satanic intrigue with that school...other than the long list of hugely tragic erroneous notions which float around the Evangelical mainstream:

      For one thing, their "support the troops" mantra, which is to say they support every gory, bloody war that gets dreamed up by the US military industrial complex (the very tip of the Antichrist's spear, if you ask me).

      Not to mention, their backing of the PreTrib rapture doctrine...which will play a central role in the Great Apostasy deception described by Jesus in the Olivet Discourse. A doctrine which will become the single greatest cause of tragedy in the history of the church world.

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  62. This stuff is rampant in the Churches and Contemporary Christian Music .

    One preacher you may want to look into is Dr. David Jeremiah . He has an All Seeing Eye window behind his pulpit and he regularly flashes Masonic / Satanic hand signals.

    A few weeks ago I saw Dr. Jeremiah hold up a Bible in his left hand and crunch his right hand into a Lion's Paw (imagine Lady Ga Ga type paw) and paw at the air over the Bible several times. It was extremely obvious and very odd. Blatant Masonic / Satanic.

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    1. I am glad you pointed that out. I used to listen to him on 90.9 FM, a local "Christian" radio station here in Texas, and never saw him on TV. After seeing him do the mano cornuto devils horns hand sign online, I knew he was not serving Jesus Christ. Another is Alistair Begg, and I loved his sermons (90.9) because he seemed so sincere and authentic. But for some reason, after a while, I felt the need to stop listening to his sermons until I worked it out with God. I admit, I had a nudging feeling to check him out online because it began to seem he was too good to be true, and saw on you tube him explaining his process for preparing for sermons. What jumped out at me was his technique he called, "thinking myself empty". That is occult talk for, moving out of the way so a demon can step in and become your mouthpiece. Of course, they don't call them demons, they call them "spirit guides" or "friendly spirits", but it is what it is.

      The final confirmation came at the end of his interview when he said his most crucial step was "to forget yourself--and I don't mean as a posture, I mean as a reality". In my opinion, he has just unzipped and packed away his sheep suit. See the video here: http://youtu.be/MXj6MLQ8138

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    2. Whoa! "Think myself empty"?? Sounds very similar to "contemplative prayer" techniques. I agree -- making way for a demon is exactly what that does. Boy -- Jeremiah is a tough pill to swallow. If all the signs of occult allegiance are coming directly from him...it is what it is, I guess. Swindoll is another huge disappointment -- duped (hopefully just 'duped') into a huge endorsement of this "empty your mind" Contemplative Prayer occultism.

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    3. It is getting harder to find real Bible-believing Christians. Observe this man's blog, who claims to be a learned biblically educated man as he challenges the biblical truth that marriage is between one man and one woman. This guy actually tries to preach that the Bible approves this:

      http://thebiblicalworld.blogspot.com/2012/03/is-this-biblical-marriage.html

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  63. Anybody have any insights into Jars of Clay, or are they okay?

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  64. Most "christian" leaders have succumbed.

    Tebow - http://youtu.be/AX1_B958Ob8

    Lecrae Reach Records - http://youtu.be/fhfBtFwdcrM
    Part 3 Trailer - http://youtu.be/rxYuRMwqdGw

    DC Talk - http://youtu.be/r7gRJFe5zt8

    Eddie Long - http://youtu.be/GIks_SdeHCI

    This list can go on and on.

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  65. Has any one on this on this site taken the time to research basic art and photography?
    Concerning illustration shading and basic photography what you are associating as being cultish is taught in the basics. The Art illustration techniques were around before the masons and probably practiced by the Greeks in Christs time.
    Isaiah 5:20
    Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
    Jesus himself never said shadows on illustrations were sin. If your faith is in God you have nothing to fear. The Gospel is the Good News!

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    1. There ARE wolves in the flock. How do you propose we go about identifying them? Not sure what you mean by "illustration techniques". There ARE occultists in the world and they DO have secretive symbols and signals.

      You need to re-read my above article. I don't dogmatically characterize folks as occultists. I simply point out the apparent occult symbolism and signaling.

      The comment that Jesus never said anything about "illustrations" is dubious. He also never said anything about texting while driving!

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    2. You are ignorant of what is running the art schools. Why don't you check out "eye" magazine. Most of the people participating in the "occult" are just ignorant sheep. The initiated have you running through their maze like rats.

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    3. Running through a maze? I don't think I'm following your argument. I simply point out the evidence of occultism which has infiltrated the church...just as the Bible predicts will be the case. Maybe you need to re-phrase or something?

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  66. Firstly, everything I read in this article is misinformed. I have studied the Occult for quite a while now, I am a Luciferian Spiritualist, and I am someone who actually exposes myself to all sorts of information. This blog was brought to my attention by an acquaintance, normally I don't care what misinformed minds have to say, but I am bored so here we go. Firstly, that first article you shared about occultism in Christian music bands is highly stupid. The word Yoni for example is Sanskrit, means womb. How they relate that word to "Satanic circles" beats me. Of course with other symbolism's such as the All-Seeing Eye, true that is used in the Occult but it being a Satanic symbol made me laugh out loud. But people, especially christians have no idea what the Occult is, it was practiced in their religion for a long, long time back in the Ancient days. Occult, is Latin for Occultus or Knowledge of the Hidden or Secrets of Life/Existence.

    Then you talk about the Emanating Rays, how it is Occult related because Lucifer is attributed with rays of Light. But so is Jesus, even said that in the bible. Jesus brings light to the world, Lucifer means Light Bringer or Light Bearer. Ergo from that kind of thinking, Jesus is Lucifer.

    Aleister Crowely wasn't a Satanist either, he was a Thelemite.

    The Kabbalah was used by all Jews and in some sects still as, especially after students finished reading the Torah and Talmud. It is more Mysticism then Occult. Christians even used it during the Renaissance which then of course converted it to fit their own dogma, meaning they changed it and screwed up its true meaning. If anything, their is more positive in the Kabbalah then anything else.

    The infinity symbol is not a Satanic symbol, the Satanic Cross is the symbol of sulfur, which has the infinity symbol in it, has nothing to do with infinity. It actually looks like a Lorraine Cross with the mathematical symbol of infinity. Because my first name is Tony, does that mean the letter T makes me a christian or a Savior because it is shaped like a cross?

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    1. Somehow you're under the impression that if you "laugh out loud" at something, this is a powerful rebuttal. Not.

      You're making all kinds of bare assertions. What good is that?

      But just to offer a basic rebuttal to what seems to be the gist of your comments -- you scoff insultingly at the idea that occultists might be secretively hidden within the world of Christian music...when, in fact, the very objective of occultists is to be...secretive and hidden. Hello?

      That is, after all, what the word means..."secret" and/or "hidden". If you're not engaged in deceptive and dishonest secretiveness and hiddenness...you're not an occultist.

      Think about it, especially from you're hugely condescending viewpoint: What would be more "fun" for an occultist than to successfully slither his way into Christian circles...and to be mistaken for a sincere Christian...all the while attempting to disrupt and damage the Christian cause?

      Actually, according to the Bible, Satan (i.e. Lucifer) has a master plan of disruption and destruction for the Christian movement...ongoing for centuries.

      A couple of your other comments --"Christians have no idea what the occult is". And you do?? Come on. We can't study and become informed in the way you assume about yourself? A rather silly prejudice, pardon my frankness.

      Another comment -- "[occultism] was practiced in their religion for a long, long time back". The oldest Scriptures going back to the early Old Testament writings expressly forbid occultism. Astrologers, soothsayers, witches, the works...all forbidden in the Bible. People who practice occultism are not of God.

      There is no deceptive, misleading hidden-ness, insider-ism or elitism in true biblical Christianity.

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    2. Anthony,

      If you are truly a "Luciferian" what is the name of your church? Do you pratice black mass on saturdays? Do you belong to a coven? Just curious.

      As a Luciferian, I am aware you are taught that lucifer is really the Christ of the Bible, but I hate to burst your bubble. Lucifer is SATAN, the SAME evil entity that has terrorized the world since its inception, and the same coward that was banished from Heaven, and the same destroyer who cares NOTHING about you, except to see you forsake Christ's salvation and dwell in the pits of Hell to torment you for eternity. His fate is ALREADY sealed, and Jesus is the Christ, and Christ defeated satan, death, and paid your debt of sin so you can see the face of Almighty God if you reject your deceived worship of damning entities, and are born again in Christ Jesus.

      I was where you are, and I hope you believe me....you have been LIED to. But you CAN STILL be saved. Please think about it.

      It is NOT too late. Lucifer is satan, the father of Lies, deceit, despair and He wants to see you give up eternal life, because He has no second chance. But you CAN be forgiven. Please take heed!

      I may be a former occult member, but I am FORGIVEN and SAVED in Christ....(which as you know, means I wear the armor of God, and any spells or magick used against me will not touch me, and will blast tenfold back at you) you are being LIED to, lucifer is a distant memory of satan, who is the SAME as any other "god" you have learned about, satan is the liar behind every one of those masks.

      I pray for you, and hope you at least CONSIDER thinking about what Christ has done for you. It is true that Jesus saves. It IS true.

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  67. Matt thank you for all your efforts to tell truth to the world. I am a parent attempting to raise my precious children as God fearing Jesus loving believes. This is hard to do in this sick confusing world of (its all ok and no big deal- the all about me generation)
    Matt bloggers like you are my hero. You are my parent filter.We parents need all the help we can get. I read as much as I could of the comments, you are doing a great job of defending the truth. Please dont stop your good work. I kinda knew the Toby thing was bad ,but third day wow bummer. What do you know of Jamie Grace? Toby seemed to butt in her music video like a bad suite at a wedding .I got sick when I saw that. My children thinks she's great .I don't allow them to be informed of secular worldly things.It's sad that a parent has to filter so much these days. It's comming in from all directions. Please stay strong in the Lord you are helping more then you know. God Bless You Matt,Sincerely A mom in training

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    1. Thanks for the kind words! I haven't seen or heard anything bad about Jamie Grace. But my standards are pretty high -- if they don't have a kind of John-the-Baptist "voice in the wilderness" aspect...they're just a waste of time for me. Just another contributor to the Ken-and-Barbie happy-happy bubble deceptions in the church world these days. Everybody snoozing away with the return of the King five minutes away, give or take a few years.

      Then again...I'll sit there listening to Casting Crowns when I'm driving the car sometimes. While they seem oblivious to the critical "end times" we are living in...at least there seems to be a sincere spiritual dimension to their music.

      It's like almost anything else in the 'church world' these days: When I go to my church on Sunday to listen to another pop psychology sermon almost devoid of solid truth...if the preacher happens to mention a Scripture in passing, sometimes the Holy Spirit will use that mere mention and give my soul something to feed on. We're living on scraps these days...unless we go into the word ourselves and/or create our own little fellowship groups consisting of other Gideon-like followers.

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  68. @matt twofour.... if a person that is new to christianity or has just accepted Jesus as their savior sees all that u put out there (which to me is a little ridiculous), they would pretty much get disappointed and go right back out. You are doing alot of damage probably without knowing so. U should use ur energy to spread the word of God in a positive way...the holy spirit takes care of the rest. There are "christian" heavy metal bands out there who give me chills when i see videos and i dont feel like they are true christ followers, i dont need anyone telling me, its obvious.


    (N I know u will probably respond with a 10 paragraph answer sounding smart, just know its just a comment!)


    God bless.

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    1. It's all "obvious"?? The Devil can be very devious. There ARE "wolves" among the flock. Not sure why you think it drives people away to see the wolves and the charlatans being pointed out. I would think it would be actually quite refreshing for outsiders to finally see a departure from all the sickeningly corrupt "prosperity gospel" money-mongering and glory-mongering that goes on in the church world, I have to believe that unchurched folks who accidentally tune into to your typical Sunday morning church telecasts...would almost toss their cookies.

      You say there's no need to warn about wolves.,,but that's what "pastoring" / shepherding is all about -- protecting the sheep who all too often wander into trouble. It's not the 'slamdunk' you think it is! How many folks are missing the fact of Toby Mac's gigantic occult symbol on his latest CD and which he placed on a previous CD with DC Talk? Huge danger signs being missed by the masses of the church world.

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  69. Just in case this shows up as anonymous: My name is Preston.

    I have read a lot this morning on your subjects. I am not here to to judge, discredit, or even argue. I would, however, like to state my opinion on a couple of images. The very first image is of Toby Mac, you state his shirt is checkered board, when in fact, it is plaid. Since the picture is black and white we don't really know what color is on the shirt. I also don't see Toby's Masonic arm position as one arm would have to be inverted to make the compass and square. His hand over the heart (Lion's Paw) is a cross cultural symbol for dedication. The Lion's Paw is typically held lower. If we are looking for symbols, why not the Rastafarian Flag on his one album? On to Michael W. Smith and his bracelets. Not sure what makes you think they are Kabbalistic as the picture is black and white. Kabbalah bracelets are typically simple red strings and Smith's look multi-colored (again, guessing as picture is black and white). Max Lucado book cover - I see nothing that look like truncated pyramids or triangles. Kenneth Copeland's book is entitled "How to Build Your Firm Foundation". The compass and square are actual, mathematical tools used in building any structure. So, I would consider this a stretch to say it is Masonic. I read once, "The inherent problem with using a hammer all the time is that everything starts to look like a nail." Wishing you the best. Follow Christ and love man.

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    1. Thanks for the challenging comments. You may prefer to opt for e-mail communication if you wish to go at length and in depth but for now...

      ...I'll just say for openers, you may need to read through at least Chapter One of my e-book (which is linked at the top of this page). You may be missing some context.

      For example, you're questioning the way in which some of Mac's indicators aren't an EXACT match. The thing you will see with occultists if you observe them long enough is...that they are hugely creative and quite at liberty to "modify" and otherwise alter the signals and symbols.

      Then there is also...the context. Mac has placed a gigantic point-blank 5000-year-old occult symbol smack on the cover of his latest CD. He is also posing on the reverse side with a rather blatantly obvious occult pose -- the rune of Tyr.,,which you can look at in depth with Smith's Tyr posing (again, in my Ch.1).

      Mac has previously placed this "all-seeing-eye" on a DC Talk CD about ten years ago....again, accompanied by controversy...which he ignored.

      So now, at the very least, he has shown willingness to engage in "appearance of evil". Whether some of my other analyses are off...it could very well be. I am not dogmatic, But there is...a context.

      The context Mac has created makes it HIGHLY likely he has other signals and symbol presentations going on. The posing with the one eye in the Disney photos...I would have to insist that is very, very obvious. As I said -- there very much appears to have even been some photo-shopping in the one Disney photo.

      As far as the Masonic indicators...you would have to read more extensively in my main e-book or in other sources...about Freemasonry's inner circle of satanic elites who virtually run the show. Many, many Illuminati slaves in the entertainment business. But that's a long story.

      If you scroll down a ways in my Ch. 1...I get into Michael W. Smith and try to provide a bit of a tutorial in satanic symbolism. I think it'll be an eye-opener if you look through it carefully. Sure, I could be wrong about the Kabbalah bracelet and yes, the 'truncated pyramid' on Lucado's book cover may be a stretch...but I become concerned and suspicious when I see him heartily endorsing "Contemplative Prayer" which is a thinly disguised occult practice (go to LightHouseTrailsResearch.com and use their search engine to read up) and being very cozy with a very questionable gang of Third Day, Smith and Mac...with whom he toured.

      Kenneth Copeland? I recommend you read carefully through my Oral Roberts sections in Chapter 13. Scroll about halfway down and look for the paragraph heading "Oral Roberts and the Robert Oxnam Connection". I get more into Copeland there. Again, you have to understand the context when you say I am making flimsy conjecture. No offense taken of course...but if you want to understand my views, you would need to do a little reading!

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  70. First, thanks for such a quick response. Second, I never said you were making a "flimsy conjecture", I may, however, implied it. Your e-book was part of my readings today and your research can not be denied, but I still feel like its a witch hunt. We tend to find what we want. Like seeing all the red cars when you are thinking of buying one. At this time I am going to concede and leave you to your own theories and practices and I will stick with mine. Until next time, Love God, Love family, Love yourself.

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    1. "Witch hunt"? Ouch! I think I liked "flimsy conjecture" better. Maybe "wolf hunt" would be a more accurate term...although God knows there are certainly enough real-as-a-heart-attack genuine, card-carrying "witches" who have deliberately and cynically infiltrated the church world...disguised as Sunday School teachers and what-not. I've seen this kind of thing eyeball-to eyeball in my years of studying the subject.

      The Bible's more accurate general term though...is "wolves". I would be curious how you would advise that I and others go about uncovering these diabolically and ingeniously disguised wolves who look like "sheep" even from 6 inches away?

      The ONLY reason I ever stumbled on the subject was from testimony of (grievously injured) ex-Satanists who, with the advent of the Information Age, were finally able to tell their stories and alert some of us to the infiltration shenanigans of very determined Satanists.

      I believe the timing of this wave of testimonies is providential...as we seem to be nearing the end times...and Jesus provides great detail in the Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24) about just this very thing:

      Jesus describes in detail regarding a huge wave of satanic infiltrators who successfully deceive the bulk of church-goers, most of whom will turn out not to have been the "real deal"...as they end up following these deceivers straight through the gates of Hell. Read the Olivet Discourse.

      Just look at the congregations of particularly the super-cool super-churches of today...and tell me the vast majority of these folks aren't glib and flip "fairweather friends"! Seriously.

      If you don't have such a dim view of todays super-faddish super-churches...then your view certainly contrasts with Jesus' view described in the Olivet Discourse.

      Yes, I'd be curious as to your 'take' since you seem such a thoughtful person -- if the Devil has a diabolical ability to deceive such that most people ever born will fall into his deception...why SHOULDN'T we be on the sharp look-out...just like any good shepherd on the lookout for preying wolves? I've been previously chided as you can well imagine "oh my, you're seeing a wolf behind every tree".

      Well no...but I'm certainly LOOKING behind many of the trees! That would be a funny thing to say to a shepherd, don't you think? (Paraphrasing you) "Oh my, you're on a wolf hunt!" Uh, why yes I am -- lol!!

      Ask yourself the question -- can you spot any current major Christian luminary who is actually a diabolically and successfully concealed satanist/wolf in the church world and who has fooled the vast majority (almost all) of church-goers. They ARE there because the Bible SAYS they are there...and are emerging in huge numbers in the last days. Call me a 'wolf-hunter' all you like!!

      Anyway...are you sure you read through the entire Michael Smith section of Ch.1 carefully and slowly? Most people come away from that very deep in thought. If I don't hear back...no hard feelings.

      Prayers and blessings,
      Matt

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  71. As I look at my black and white checkered shirt hanging up across the room from me that I considered wearing to church that is hanging on a clothes hanger which is in the shape of a triangle, I can't help but wonder if one of Satan's devices is paranoia.

    The triangle is proven to be the strongest geometric shape, therefore (with the fact that it is a basic shape) it is common in society. Point is, the triangle existed before the illuminati. Black and white are neutral colors, and so on. Is there demonic influence in the world? Yes. But we can over-dramatize things to fit our argument and manipulate how we see things to try and prove a point and create division in what should be a unified group of believers.
    I don't care if there is an image of Toby Mac putting his hands on his chest the same exact way I stand for the Pledge of Allegiance (and no one waste your strength typing out how the Pledge of Allegiance has evil influence behind it, because I know why I recite it and that's all that matters) but Toby Mac writes songs that glorify God and no matter his true intent, people legitimately worship God through the music he writes.

    On a side note, any stance of self righteousness, or the felt need of rebuking and correcting others on this conversation is not being salt and light to the lost world and the potential millions of lost souls who come across this site. So instead of spending days and weeks on this post bantering over, quite frankly, pointless "facts" that can only be deemed true by a heart judging God, let's honor God by physically helping "the last of these".

    And before I get the remark, the Bible also says judgement begins at the house of God. If you will quote the Bible, this convo might as well be the house of God. So did I pass some form of judgement? Yes I did.

    Comment however you will, my point is made. I won't be back to respond.

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    1. OK so...was it alright to "pass judgment" or not? Because you certainly were judgmental in your comments...using your own definition of "judgmental". A bit ironic, no?

      Yes, the Devil certainly can and does use "paranoia". Doesn't change the fact that Masons use black and white tiling as a secret signal. And if Toby didn't display about a dozen other occult symbols and signals...I wouldn't wonder about his shirt. Feel free to wear your checkered shirt.

      And yes, the "Pledge of Allegiance" pose has an occult origin but...pledge if you must. Each of us with awareness of our occult surroundings has our gag reflex triggered at different levels and at different times. I certainly cannot get out of the grocery store without a dozen items with satanic corporate logos on them. The vast majority of major corporate logos in America are signaling occult allegiance. Just read the latter part of my Chapter One and all of Chapter Eleven (in my e-book linked above).

      And yes you can continue to put a Christmas tree in your home even though it has point-blank satanic origins and even though there appears to be a point-blank Scripture forbidding Christmas trees in one's home (Jeremiah 10:3,4). But as for me, that's one of those things that trips my gag reflex, frankly.

      And yes, the triangle is an official geometric shape. And it is also doubles as a satanic symbol. What to do...what to do? Apparently, Satanists can walk and chew gum at the same time.

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    1. A "test"? I moderate comments here so you'll need to first present your comments and then I 'publish' them. Unless your comments are purely insulting and/or garbled nonsense, I'll post your comments. Challenge me or agree with me in any way you wish!

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  73. Matt, I posted your blog on Vigilant Citizen because there is an article there about Toby Mac. I hope you don't mind. The comments there are moderated, so we'll see if it gets posted. Hope you are well...
    ~Labby

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  74. Matt,

    Great post and good research. Thanks for getting this stuff out there. Jesus is the way the truth and the life. Have you studied the prophecy of Daniel and the 4 the beasts? If so what do you make of that???

    Thanks,

    K

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  75. It would appear that Vigilant Citizen is not posting what I wrote, which included links to your articles. We'll wait and see I guess.
    ~Labby

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  76. I think honestly if you want to believe that these artist are satanic or illuminati, first maybe you should ask them. Don't assume or judge based on what you think. I wear peace signs cause I think they are cute, but a lady at my church thinks I am supporting satanism because of it. I'm not and I don't think the peace sign is satanic.

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I am once again allowing anonymous comment but will continue to "moderate".